stepper driver problem ??

Topics around mechanical design, controller and electronics. Mods & hacks welcome.
Pierre
Posts: 35
Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2016 8:19 am

stepper driver problem ??

Postby Pierre » Sat Oct 01, 2016 10:24 am

Hi there !

We receive our 2 new N2 dual plus and I have a problem with one of them.

I'm trying to print something that I allready printed successfully with our first machine, and I get this problem during X moves :

IMG_20161001_100856.jpg

IMG_20160930_225133.jpg


I checked all screws and belts and found nothing.

Do you think it's a stepper driver problem ?

I have no spare TMC2100 but I have some A4988 left . Can I try to replace the TMC2100 with a A4988 ?

Have a nice day

Pierre

Jetguy
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Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2016 1:40 am
Location: In a van, down by the river

Re: stepper driver problem ??

Postby Jetguy » Sat Oct 01, 2016 1:14 pm

It's not a stepper driver problem, not in a long shot. The myth also needs to stop here, it's not driver overheating. If the driver really over heated, the shift would be inches or over to the other side of the bed.

Fix the problem, either the nozzle was just catching your support layers from over extrusion or warping/lifting of the previous layer, or your mechanics have too much friction and you need to test and find it.

Pierre
Posts: 35
Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2016 8:19 am

Re: stepper driver problem ??

Postby Pierre » Sat Oct 01, 2016 1:38 pm

Thank you for your answer jetguy,

I forgot to say some informations:
I'm using a 0.5 mm zhop to minimize the risk of head colision. I also removed the right nozle for the same purpose.
When the head moves in the direction of the problem, i can ear a noisy vibration coming from i don't know where.
The gcode works fine on another N2 machine with exactly the same parameters and material.
When I manually moves the head, i don't feel any differece between the 2 machines. And all belts and screws seems to be tight the same. That's why I thought it could be an electronic problem.
Which method would you use to test the friction of this axis?

Thanks by advance
Pierre

Jetguy
Posts: 2849
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2016 1:40 am
Location: In a van, down by the river

Re: stepper driver problem ??

Postby Jetguy » Sat Oct 01, 2016 2:19 pm

Moving the head by hand to determine the level of friction.
"When the head moves in the direction of the problem, i can ear a noisy vibration coming from i don't know where."
Confirmed, that's definitely an issue and it's likely related to minor alignment problems. You are getting stick-slip, a condition where a bushing (remember, the outer ring of sliders are bushings not linear ball bearings because the shafts rotate and slide) grabs, then the angle allows it to slip causing the vibration and sound you mentioned. While folks lube more in this condition, I would encourage to find the alignment problem causing stick-slip and solve that, as lube is messy and not a good fix IMO. The linear bushings have graphite dry lube inserts and were not meant for lube in the first place, and yet the bulk of users ignore that or are not aware of it. For reference, i wiped down all my shafts on day one, removed all excess grease, and have never lubed my machine since the day of getting it and to this day, can only remember 2 times printing ABS where i had a layer shift and that was a nozzle strike due to curling. Again, my shafts are bone dry, have been from day one without issue.

I've written about it before, switching stepper drivers might give slightly more torque, however, that is a tradeoff of noise.
Also, the one other person who did this seems to be complaining that they are then having overheating problems (real ones where the driver does actually switch off for periods of time).

In your case, you really need to solve this mechanical issue. I would loosen the screws locking one side of the central cross rods. In other words, the back and right slider blocks have an M4 screw locking the 8mm central X rods. Loosen those 2 screws (right side and rear only) and attempt manual motion, check for ease of sliding, then try a print in this condition.

Pierre
Posts: 35
Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2016 8:19 am

Re: stepper driver problem ??

Postby Pierre » Sat Oct 01, 2016 5:30 pm

Thanks a lot jetguy

I ll do this as soon as possible.

Have a nice evening
Pierre

Pierre
Posts: 35
Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2016 8:19 am

Re: stepper driver problem ??

Postby Pierre » Wed Oct 05, 2016 8:47 am

Hi there,

I did what Jetguy said, but I still have the problem. I think I did it not good enough. I'll do it again but i'm not sure I will be able to solve the problem by myself.

Have a nice day
Pierre

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woofy
Posts: 98
Joined: Sun Jun 12, 2016 4:09 pm

Re: stepper driver problem ??

Postby woofy » Wed Oct 05, 2016 12:51 pm

Same thing happens to me:
http://www.woofys-place.co.uk/files/bracket1.mp4

In both our cases it looks as if the shift is a multiple of a structure on the model. It's as if an x movement was completely missed.
I'm wondering if this is a software issue: maybe a communication race condition between display/stepper boards?
Raise3D N2+, Ultimaker2 & UP plus printers.

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woofy
Posts: 98
Joined: Sun Jun 12, 2016 4:09 pm

Re: stepper driver problem ??

Postby woofy » Wed Oct 05, 2016 12:51 pm

That's an old video BTW, but the issue remains.
Raise3D N2+, Ultimaker2 & UP plus printers.

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Vicky@Raise3D
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Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2016 3:54 am

Re: stepper driver problem ??

Postby Vicky@Raise3D » Wed Oct 05, 2016 1:32 pm

Pierre wrote:Hi there,

I did what Jetguy said, but I still have the problem. I think I did it not good enough. I'll do it again but i'm not sure I will be able to solve the problem by myself.

Have a nice day
Pierre


If still have problem, please shoot a ticket on our ticket system. We can set one-to-one help for you there.

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walshlg
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Joined: Wed Mar 23, 2016 12:01 pm

Re: stepper driver problem ??

Postby walshlg » Wed Oct 05, 2016 1:34 pm

when this happens do you hear loud clunking sounds?

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Vicky@Raise3D
Posts: 5942
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2016 3:54 am

Re: stepper driver problem ??

Postby Vicky@Raise3D » Wed Oct 05, 2016 1:35 pm

woofy wrote:Same thing happens to me:
http://www.woofys-place.co.uk/files/bracket1.mp4

In both our cases it looks as if the shift is a multiple of a structure on the model. It's as if an x movement was completely missed.
I'm wondering if this is a software issue: maybe a communication race condition between display/stepper boards?


If your problem is only at X direction, have you exchanged X and Y's driver yet?
Turn the power off. Open the electronic box's cover. Move X stepper driver to Y slot. Move Y to X slot.
Then check whether the problem moves to Y direction.


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