Problems with Ninjaflex

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JohnSays
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Problems with Ninjaflex

Postby JohnSays » Wed Aug 24, 2016 2:26 pm

Using N2, direct drive Bondtec, 0.4mm nozzle and mocha Ninjaflex.

For about three days I have been trying to get a good print with Ninjaflex. This should not be so hard and others have clearly had good success with it. So why not me? I started with the setting Andy Cohen used. I tried two new nozzles and cleaning them between print tests. I varied speed, temperature, flow rate, retraction, cooling, and on and on. No matter what I did the stuff under-extruded. I even moved the flow rate up to 200 with no noticeable change. I printed at 250C -- pretty far outside the temp range. No go. I was getting a bunch of stringy stuff semi-formed into a calibration box. Very frustrating. I even bought another spool of a different color to see if I just had a bad spool. And, yes, I did dry them.

So, today, while the filament was running yet another test, I had my fingers on the filament just where it enters the PTFE tube and, to my senses, it seemed to be moving way too slow. So what up with that? Okay -- cutting to the chase -- the spool is wound too tight and the filament does not want to come off easily. It would seem that the spool is wound tight enough to create a grip between the filament wraps. Thus, as the direct drive is working to pull the filament off the spool, it is stretching.

So I unrolled about 25 feet of the stuff and then gently would it back onto the spool and presto-magicko I started getting good extrusion. In all the reading I have done to figure out how to use this stuff, I never came across this little vital tidbit of information so I thought I should share it here. So apparently re-spooling this stuff is vital and is working for me.
Last edited by JohnSays on Tue Dec 20, 2016 3:30 pm, edited 4 times in total.
- John

2 Raise3D N2 Duals, Bondtech BMGs, adjustable table, Panucatt SD2224 drivers, run-out sensor, thermal overload protection, Firmware 1.1.9ABH - with Lin_Advance, Palette 2 Pro, Custom E3D hot end and ultra-light carriage and printer head

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walshlg
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Re: Problems with Ninjaflex

Postby walshlg » Wed Aug 24, 2016 4:27 pm

Sun of a gun, makes you also wonder about guide tube friction, maybe oiling things would help??

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JohnSays
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Re: Problems with Ninjaflex

Postby JohnSays » Thu Aug 25, 2016 2:50 am

Actually the filament moves in the guide tube very nicely even when being pushed. I'd be afraid of "oiling" as it that would add a foreign substance to the filament and then where would you be? Not in Kansas anymore.
- John

2 Raise3D N2 Duals, Bondtech BMGs, adjustable table, Panucatt SD2224 drivers, run-out sensor, thermal overload protection, Firmware 1.1.9ABH - with Lin_Advance, Palette 2 Pro, Custom E3D hot end and ultra-light carriage and printer head

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obfuscated
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Re: Problems with Ninjaflex

Postby obfuscated » Tue Sep 20, 2016 5:18 pm

Yeah I tried to do a test with Ninjaflex this morning and could not get it to load.. seemed like as soon as it started to reach the hotend the gear would start slipping on the filament :(

RogerSt
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Re: Problems with Ninjaflex

Postby RogerSt » Tue Sep 20, 2016 8:22 pm

I have printet with NinjaFlex Flex and Semifley without any problems.
I used the left hotend, because the extruder is closer to the hotend.
I printet with 240C and 30mm/s speed.
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obfuscated
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Re: Problems with Ninjaflex

Postby obfuscated » Wed Sep 21, 2016 12:45 am

RogerSt wrote:I have printet with NinjaFlex Flex and Semifley without any problems.
I used the left hotend, because the extruder is closer to the hotend.
I printet with 240C and 30mm/s speed.


I was trying to load it into the left hotend but it seems like it gets jammed and then the gear just starts slipping on it

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JohnSays
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Re: Problems with Ninjaflex

Postby JohnSays » Wed Sep 21, 2016 2:58 am

Yeah, unless someone has a good idea how to make a TPU based filament (Ninjaflex et al) work in the Raise3D stock system, my bet is on using the BondTech extruder. That is what I am using and one of the reasons I upgraded to it.
- John

2 Raise3D N2 Duals, Bondtech BMGs, adjustable table, Panucatt SD2224 drivers, run-out sensor, thermal overload protection, Firmware 1.1.9ABH - with Lin_Advance, Palette 2 Pro, Custom E3D hot end and ultra-light carriage and printer head

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walshlg
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Re: Problems with Ninjaflex

Postby walshlg » Wed Sep 21, 2016 5:12 pm

For me, the trick is block the bottom of the fan duct, like for ABS, and then I can print at 225C! But only with the brass nozzle.

Also, unload after every print and reload before start, this heads off a lot of problems.

HOWEVER - this was for semiflex, ninjaflex order on the way.

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Vicky@Raise3D
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Re: Problems with Ninjaflex

Postby Vicky@Raise3D » Thu Sep 22, 2016 5:52 am

Please advise when you find no extruding and then unload the filament, can the filament be extruded properly when re-loading?

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walshlg
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Re: Problems with Ninjaflex

Postby walshlg » Thu Sep 22, 2016 2:21 pm

oh btw, the reason I always unload is that the filament gets kinks that I trim off.

ANother thing - I can't use the guide tube - I use the other guide tube with a loop of wire around it to act like a ferrule in a fishing rod.

NewbPilot
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Re: Problems with Ninjaflex

Postby NewbPilot » Thu Sep 22, 2016 3:50 pm

My ninjaflex printing tests failed ... i got Sainsmart TPU printing gorgeous ... I have PolyFlex printing "ok". I have Ninjaflex sitting in a bin :(

jvingaard
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Re: Problems with Ninjaflex

Postby jvingaard » Mon Dec 19, 2016 9:06 am

I just smear a littel Olive Oli on the filement. :D

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JohnSays
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Re: Problems with Ninjaflex

Postby JohnSays » Tue Dec 20, 2016 3:32 pm

Did any of you having problems try my solution at the start of this thread?
- John

2 Raise3D N2 Duals, Bondtech BMGs, adjustable table, Panucatt SD2224 drivers, run-out sensor, thermal overload protection, Firmware 1.1.9ABH - with Lin_Advance, Palette 2 Pro, Custom E3D hot end and ultra-light carriage and printer head

Jetguy
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Re: Problems with Ninjaflex

Postby Jetguy » Tue Dec 20, 2016 4:03 pm

Yes, I recently printed Ninjaflex and found the friction to the guide tubes (my own 4mm PTFE tubing since mine was an early Kickstarter unit and did not come with guide tubes) was causing drag. I lazily pulled a bunch of filament through the tube by hand to leave a free coil or loop for feeding to the extruder but had to monitor the print and keep the slack but no so much to let it droop and then somehow get caught into the motion.

A couple of things come to mind.
As much as I hate overhead spools, for Nijaflex, that's one option (say make a rack frame out of cheap PVC tubing and pipe fittings).
Or
Use a much larger 5mm ID thin wall PTFE tubing that would be less internal contact and extremely less likely to bind (FYI, same tubing used on a 3D systems Cube X and Pro series printers). Called material guide tube here http://www.3dsystems.com/shop/supplies/cubex

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JohnSays
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Re: Problems with Ninjaflex

Postby JohnSays » Sat Jan 07, 2017 3:17 am

Good ideas Jetguy. My spool seems to be the problem in that the ninjaflex is actually binding on itself on the spool. Are you sure that is not happening with you? If so, maybe a re-spooling would do the trick.
- John

2 Raise3D N2 Duals, Bondtech BMGs, adjustable table, Panucatt SD2224 drivers, run-out sensor, thermal overload protection, Firmware 1.1.9ABH - with Lin_Advance, Palette 2 Pro, Custom E3D hot end and ultra-light carriage and printer head


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