New Extruder, Bad Jam

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rgriesbeck
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New Extruder, Bad Jam

Postby rgriesbeck » Sun Jun 19, 2016 5:25 am

So I finally got time to install my V2 extruder and it seemed to be going well... I got a handfull of good prints using both R3D filament and some TBL PLA I had, until I started getting air prints. I tried cleaning out the extruder with the long metal rods (supplied with printer) and it seemed OK until the rod wouldn't come back out!?!?

So I gently tried to twist and pull and finally got it out. I removed the V2 extruder and there seemed to be some plastic almost totally blocking the top of the hot end (see attached). I managed to remove some of the filament from the top with a tweezer, but I'm not sure what to do now. I really don't want to buy a new V2 extruder as this one only has a few prints on it...

Should I try to unplug it externally somehow? or re-install it again? or go back to V1?

TIA
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2016-06-16 20.39.03.jpg

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Vicky@Raise3D
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Re: New Extruder, Bad Jam

Postby Vicky@Raise3D » Sun Jun 19, 2016 6:24 am

I suggest you disassemble the hotend first. The steps should be:
1. Hold the heating block with wrench. Remove the nozzle with a sleeve.
2. Remove the throat tube manually.

NOTE: DO NOT apply any force to throat tube or you will damage it.

When you disassemble everything apart, use the steel wire to dredge the throat tube. Assemble the parts back when you sure the throat tube is totally clean inside.

Here is the assembling instruction from our website. Please do follow every step.
http://www.raise3d.com/pages/instructio ... assembling
Nozzle manually first, then throat tube manually. Then tighten the nozzle with tool.

DO NOT apply any force to your throat tube.

rgriesbeck
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Re: New Extruder, Bad Jam

Postby rgriesbeck » Mon Jun 20, 2016 3:49 am

Can you give me any more info on disassembly?

Also, what kind of silicon grease should I use on reassembly?

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Vicky@Raise3D
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Re: New Extruder, Bad Jam

Postby Vicky@Raise3D » Mon Jun 20, 2016 9:59 am

Since you have already removed the whole hotend from print head.Now you only need to disassemble the parts.

The disassembling steps should be:
1. Hold the heating block with a wrench.
1.jpg

2. Loosen the nozzle with a sleeve.
2.jpg

3. Remove the nozzle.

4. Loosen the throat tube with hands and remove it.


The sillicone grease it not necessary to use.

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walshlg
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Re: New Extruder, Bad Jam

Postby walshlg » Mon Jun 20, 2016 2:41 pm

and once you get the nozzle off, then the cleaning rod will go all the way through BUT when hot, even with a blockage, the isolation tube should screw out with finger pressure force.

rgriesbeck
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Re: New Extruder, Bad Jam

Postby rgriesbeck » Mon Jun 20, 2016 3:05 pm

Vicky@Raise3D wrote:Since you have already removed the whole hotend from print head.Now you only need to disassemble the parts.


4. Loosen the throat tube with hands and remove it.


The sillicone grease it not necessary to use.


OK, I guess I don't know what the throat tube is, but I'm guessing it'll be obvious when the nozzle is off...

thanks, wish me luck

Ben Roj
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Re: New Extruder, Bad Jam

Postby Ben Roj » Mon Jun 20, 2016 3:14 pm

Important point is that if it is very hard to remove the nozzle, don't try to force it. You should do this while it is hot - heat to 120-150c should be enough, and when assemble back, you need to tighten while heat the nozzle to ensure there is be no gap between nozzle and tube.
I have this happened to me too, but I just use drill to remove the plastic blockage (have to be careful not to touch the inner surface of the tube)

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walshlg
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Re: New Extruder, Bad Jam

Postby walshlg » Mon Jun 20, 2016 3:31 pm

the throat tube, aka isolation tube, aka heat break tube, aka cold end tube is the part marked with the K in the above picture. THose nifty heat / thermal fins unscrew and you can then see the whole tube. It gets very thin right near the aluminum block because thin walls can't transfer heat very well and its job is to connect the hot end to the cold end mechanically but preventing heat transfer up the tube as much as possible.

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walshlg
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Re: New Extruder, Bad Jam

Postby walshlg » Mon Jun 20, 2016 3:34 pm

btw, I fnd that its much easier to hold the hot aluminum block in a pair of vice grip pliers, onto which I taped thin shims of wood using Kapton tape.

the wood gives thermal isolation and softens the grip, the kapton is safe with heat, and the vice grips eliminate the need to grip with your hand and you can dial in the compressive force a well.

rgriesbeck
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Re: New Extruder, Bad Jam

Postby rgriesbeck » Mon Jun 20, 2016 4:40 pm

OK, now I"m scared...

I've got it out of the printer atm, I should hook it back up and heat it up?

Or to I try the drill technique? And is that done while hot? With nozzle removed?

Zettlinger
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Re: New Extruder, Bad Jam

Postby Zettlinger » Mon Jun 20, 2016 11:25 pm

i used a tiny torch (to make creme brulee) it uses simple lighter gas to heat it up so i could safely do it in a more convenient place then hanging off the printer :)

Not sure if you were in NL if so send me a PM

rgriesbeck
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Re: New Extruder, Bad Jam

Postby rgriesbeck » Tue Jun 21, 2016 12:00 am

Zettlinger wrote:i used a tiny torch (to make creme brulee) it uses simple lighter gas to heat it up so i could safely do it in a more convenient place then hanging off the printer :)

Not sure if you were in NL if so send me a PM


Ok, do I heat the block or the nozzle? Then once the nozzle is off, should I heat what's left so I can try to get the plastic out?

Thanks,

PS I'm in Canada

Zettlinger
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Re: New Extruder, Bad Jam

Postby Zettlinger » Tue Jun 21, 2016 12:39 am

I removed the nozzle first. (then check with the wire to see if that was the blockage)

If the wire does not go through take off the alu block and fins then heat the throat tube. The plastic should ooze out, if not use the wire again but be careful to not pull up more liquid plastic

Make sure to read up on assembly of the hotend or you might ruin the throat tube or alu block

rgriesbeck
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Re: New Extruder, Bad Jam

Postby rgriesbeck » Tue Jun 21, 2016 3:35 am

I followed the excellent advice, reassembled it and it started to feed filament, but it didn't come out smoothly, bunched up. So I unloaded it and tried to reload, but then I looked at the filament and it looked pretty sketchy. So I tried to reload and it just ticks again...

I think that initially I probably damaged the tube when the cleaning wire was stuck and had to pull really hard to get it out.

Looks like I'm going to have to buy another V2 hotend - grrrr. Wish I had got more than 10 prints off this one

rgriesbeck
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Re: New Extruder, Bad Jam

Postby rgriesbeck » Tue Jun 21, 2016 3:36 am

Here's the filament
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2016-06-20 20.13.07.jpg

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Vicky@Raise3D
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Re: New Extruder, Bad Jam

Postby Vicky@Raise3D » Tue Jun 21, 2016 3:47 am

Was the cooling fan at the side of print head working proper when loading the filament?

It seems that the throat tube is not totally clean. I suggest you do more clean job.

rgriesbeck
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Re: New Extruder, Bad Jam

Postby rgriesbeck » Tue Jun 21, 2016 4:14 am

Vicky@Raise3D wrote:Was the cooling fan at the side of print head working proper when loading the filament?

It seems that the throat tube is not totally clean. I suggest you do more clean job.


Yes the fan was working. The throat was clean, I heated it externally and used the wire to clean, I could see light through it...

Not 100% sure the nozzle was clean, advice on cleaning it?

But I worry that the throat was damaged because initially, the wire was stuck pretty bad...

I'll probably order another as I need this fixed ASAP, I just emailed sales...

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Vicky@Raise3D
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Re: New Extruder, Bad Jam

Postby Vicky@Raise3D » Tue Jun 21, 2016 5:31 am

rgriesbeck wrote:
Vicky@Raise3D wrote:Was the cooling fan at the side of print head working proper when loading the filament?

It seems that the throat tube is not totally clean. I suggest you do more clean job.


Yes the fan was working. The throat was clean, I heated it externally and used the wire to clean, I could see light through it...

Not 100% sure the nozzle was clean, advice on cleaning it?

But I worry that the throat was damaged because initially, the wire was stuck pretty bad...

I'll probably order another as I need this fixed ASAP, I just emailed sales...


What is the black filament you used to clean the nozzle? PLA or ABS? What temperature did you use?

Zettlinger
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Re: New Extruder, Bad Jam

Postby Zettlinger » Tue Jun 21, 2016 11:06 am

rgriesbeck replace the nozzle and see if it solves the problem if you are sure the throat tube is clean as a whistle.

If it is the nozzle i usually replace it and i will wait until i have a few clogged ones to torch them all together to see if they are fixable or need to be replaced

Cleaning the nozzle is almost the same you burn it to a crisp the big blobs will ooze out and the rest should turn to ash that you can wipe out
(i still need to find myself a guitar string to clean the tiny nozzle, TIP FOR RAISE3D to add a gitar string with the 2 wires they already supply :) )

Goodluck ! (it will get easier the more you do it ;) )

rgriesbeck
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Re: New Extruder, Bad Jam

Postby rgriesbeck » Wed Jun 22, 2016 1:24 am

Vicky@Raise3D wrote:
rgriesbeck wrote:
Vicky@Raise3D wrote:Was the cooling fan at the side of print head working proper when loading the filament?

It seems that the throat tube is not totally clean. I suggest you do more clean job.


Yes the fan was working. The throat was clean, I heated it externally and used the wire to clean, I could see light through it...

Not 100% sure the nozzle was clean, advice on cleaning it?

But I worry that the throat was damaged because initially, the wire was stuck pretty bad...

I'll probably order another as I need this fixed ASAP, I just emailed sales...


What is the black filament you used to clean the nozzle? PLA or ABS? What temperature did you use?


It's your PLA at 210...


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