Adapted Olsson Ruby nozzles

Topics around mechanical design, controller and electronics. Mods & hacks welcome.
pjyarnall
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Location: Canandaigua, NY

Adapted Olsson Ruby nozzles

Postby pjyarnall » Tue Jul 31, 2018 2:40 am

If you are printing any filled filaments, glass or carbon fiber in particular, you know that brass nozzles have a half life measured in hours. Don't bother buying the Raise3D "hard" nozzles. They are not hard. They are essentially the same standard brass nozzles with an electroless nickel alloy plating. They have a half life a few minutes longer than the unplated version.

I installed a MK A2 hardened steel nozzle. They lack the countersunk feature of the proprietary R3D design, but it lasted longer than brass. I had to raise extruder temps a bit.

If you are printing a lot of filled filaments then the best long term solution is the Olsson Ruby. $90 at MatterHacker. When you consider the time lost to changing out nozzles and the exponentially longer service life, they are a bargain..

The problem is that they are not a happy substitute in the Pro2 hot end for length and mating to the throat tube. So I designed a modified Olsson and my super talented friend and fellow Pro 2 owner did the precision machining required to make them work. Pics below.

The 3mm spacer is intended to go to the heat sink tightly for maximum heat transfer. We choose to tighten the throat tube up to the nozzle instead of leaving a gap. We have encountered no problems to date.
Attachments
B4528D26-809D-41F0-B7A7-C421708323D6.jpeg
BE0FC331-CEB6-45C9-AC76-C6AAFF5BD40D.jpeg
Pro 2

Sunshine
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Joined: Mon Nov 26, 2018 12:53 pm

Re: Adapted Olsson Ruby nozzles

Postby Sunshine » Fri Feb 22, 2019 7:37 am

It's been a while since you posted this. How has it worked up til now?

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ocelot27
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Location: Malvern, PA

Re: Adapted Olsson Ruby nozzles

Postby ocelot27 » Fri Feb 22, 2019 2:40 pm

I want to add that this place is coming out with dedicated Pro2 ruby nozzles soon:

https://3dsolex.com/product-category/raise3d/

-john

Sunshine
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Joined: Mon Nov 26, 2018 12:53 pm

Re: Adapted Olsson Ruby nozzles

Postby Sunshine » Fri Feb 22, 2019 2:46 pm

ocelot27 wrote:I want to add that this place is coming out with dedicated Pro2 ruby nozzles soon:

https://3dsolex.com/product-category/raise3d/

-john



That is great news! Thanks for that!

Where did you read it?

zemlin
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Joined: Sat Oct 21, 2017 2:02 pm

Re: Adapted Olsson Ruby nozzles

Postby zemlin » Fri Feb 22, 2019 4:30 pm

fwiw - I've been running Ollson ruby nozzles with no mods. I did have sealing issues against the throat tube, however - I started using a PEEK washer as a gasket between the throat and nozzle. It's worked well for me.
viewtopic.php?f=17&t=13284

Ackta79
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Joined: Sat Feb 02, 2019 9:22 am

Re: Adapted Olsson Ruby nozzles

Postby Ackta79 » Wed Apr 10, 2019 9:34 am

@ pjyarnall Can you upload more info for mod the olsson?
Thanks

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ocelot27
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Location: Malvern, PA

Re: Adapted Olsson Ruby nozzles

Postby ocelot27 » Thu Apr 25, 2019 12:40 pm

3DSolex has ruby nozzles for the Pro2 now...

https://3dsolex.com/69-pro-2

-john

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jetdillo
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Re: Adapted Olsson Ruby nozzles

Postby jetdillo » Mon May 27, 2019 5:02 am

So, it's been a couple years now since both the Solex and E3D6 mods came out. I'm wondering if I should get a set of Solex nozzles for my N2 or do the E3D upgrade/changover. I just had another annoying experience with a serious hot-end jam in my N2+ where I had to take the whole assembly apart, go at the throat tube and nozzle w/ a heatgun and then deal with a filament leak, take it all apart again, etc.
This is after re-assembling things using the hot-end alignment block I printed out a while back.

I fixed the leak and things are humming along again but I'm tempted to move to the E3D system(even though this means buying all new nozzles again) because this took about a week of evenings to fix. OTOH, there seems to be a number of happy Solex users here. I need truly hardened nozzles because I'm moving into printing abrasives more and more.

Jetguy
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Re: Adapted Olsson Ruby nozzles

Postby Jetguy » Mon May 27, 2019 11:58 am

#1 Get Solex nozzles. They are some of the best nozzles I've used in 10 years of 3D printing. The special 5 axis CNC machined melt path in these nozzles mixes and flows the filament other cheaper machined nozzles that can't match. The only other nozzles I use are Ruby for abrasives, and E3D copper for flex materials due to superior heat conduction. For general very day high performance use, I think Solex is superior.
#2 Definitely ALSO get the E3D matching hotend. Personally I went the extra steps and cost of titanium thermal barrier tube and all copper block, but worth every penny in terms of performance and longevity. While at it, also get the premium 24V E3D heater cartridge and the matching E3D cartridge style thermocouple- both work with Raise 3D electronics.
#3 You can use ALL of your existing Raise 3D nozzles with an E3D block system, so you are not wasting existing hardware. Yes, they are all compatible M6 threads and length.

Jetguy
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Location: In a van, down by the river

Re: Adapted Olsson Ruby nozzles

Postby Jetguy » Mon May 27, 2019 12:16 pm

Again, the faults here of the original N series V2 hotends.
The heater block is large and long making radiated heat a problem. Insulation helps, but a huge part of the problem is just the size of the block being hot.
The M4 threads of thermal barrier tube are simply not strong enough under prolonged use and especially multiple assembly and heat cycles. The reason is, the M6 threaded hole for the nozzle leaves very little block material left for the M4 threads, so the number of threads in contact, the fact it's aluminum, under high temp, and small diameter M4 is a failure point. Eventually, you tighten the nozzle and that pushes up on the thermal barrier (AKA throat tube) and rips the M4 threads right out of the aluminum heater block.
While the titanium stock thermal barrier tube is nice, the heatsink interface to remove any heat conducted across the threaded tube section is limited by the heatsink contact area. This has just never been a good part of the design.

The E3D adapter upgrade fixes these in the following ways:
First, at the heatsink- E3D uses an M7 threaded interface to the thermal barrier tube. Threads give superior thermal contact and pressure of metal to metal to transfer any heat in the thermal barrier tube to the heatsink to remove it thus keeping the thermal barrier cooler.
The E3D thermal barrier is also M6 threaded at the heater block for a superior mechanical attachment to the heater block and no more complex and weak stepped bore design of the heater block.
E3D also offers titanium thermal barriers, which matches the original material Raise 3D used for limited conduction while maintaining good mechanical strength and toughness. Again the thermal barrier tube is intentionally thin wall to limit thermal conduction between the hot hair block and the rest of the cold end of the extruder system, but larger diameter of the E3D system offers a mechanical and longevity solution when compared to the stock V2 system.
The E3D heater block is much smaller, but also has much better features. First is the clamping method of gripping the heating rod VS the set screw pushing the heating cartridge to the side of a bore as in the V2. better machining, better material, cheaper and more plentiful parts, the E3D is superior to he proprietary system Raise 3D has developed. Considering a V2 is what, $80-$90 before shipping, only available from Raise3D as a sole source supplier, VS E3d being worldwide, there just is no comparison.

Raise 3D should have partnered here and dropped the V2, but nooooo, that would be far too logical and good for the customer....
So then you see the evolution and debacle known as the Pro hotend - the V2 cut down with even less heatsink and still failure prone M4 heater block interface......

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ocelot27
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Re: Adapted Olsson Ruby nozzles

Postby ocelot27 » Mon Jun 10, 2019 9:05 pm

I like the Solex nozzles too but I've only tried the ruby so it's suboptimal compared to a fully machined nozzle for nonabrasive stuff - comparable to the Olsson IMO.

I think the mosquito is superior to the E3D hot end though - really nice to not have to deal with holding the block when torquing a nozzle and they even make a 1.5NM calibrated torque wrench. The machining/build quality of the mosquito is pretty sick and everything about it was optimized. I lost 20mm of vertical build when I had them on my Pro2 but I thinking of putting them back on - need to have better adapter plates made.

The Raise Pro2 hot end design is a disgrace - unusable. Just sloppy engineering. 300°C... right... maybe in a walk-in freezer with the printer open and fans blowing into it.

-john


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