Clog or heat creep

Thoughts about Raise3D, 3D printing and making in general.
Shelton
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Clog or heat creep

Postby Shelton » Fri Apr 03, 2020 10:54 am

How to avoid worst nightmares - clog or heat creep under extruder section?

First, remove both printing heads. Disassembly. Clear nozzles and throat tubes. Check throat tubes twice or more. Gently use drill by bare hands... or if you are PRO use electric tool Warring: don't destroy it... and injure yourself!

Next, assembly. Use thermopaste for microprocessor on all threats to prevent bad heat distribution. Please check paste specification - temp. range. You should use 280 C as a lower option.

Last check your main fan. When you touch it - it should back to normal speed after sec. if not... or if work slower replaces it!

Main fan bracket opens two internal holes to the upper bridge - bracket. Use Dremel or similar or print-ready 3D part. Remember about temperature and aluminium protecting tape to prevent melting!

Last use 3D printed offsets part to move both material fans outside for better throat tubes cooling.

Some time please use hardwood filament to clean throat tubes without disassembly.

Las thing I almost forgot about it... clean or replace upper extruder Teflon tubes... and also under filament section. You need to push collar to remove pipe.

mdana
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Re: Clog or heat creep

Postby mdana » Fri Apr 03, 2020 7:47 pm

Are you using thermal paste on the heat break/heater block?

Shelton
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Re: Clog or heat creep

Postby Shelton » Fri Apr 03, 2020 7:58 pm

Yes... but today after few hours we have the same issue clogging. Nightmare. Hotend sucks in PRO2.

Shelton
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Re: Clog or heat creep

Postby Shelton » Tue Apr 07, 2020 11:39 am

What about hot end replacement? What about you Raise 3D team? Nothing? Printer only prints with ABS... with other materials. Don't or sometimes. Everyone - should get right to money back. That is serious design fault.

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Vicky@Raise3D
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Re: Clog or heat creep

Postby Vicky@Raise3D » Tue Apr 07, 2020 11:51 pm

Would you like to advise what brand of filament you have tried?
Are you printing with Top Cover on or off?
Would you like take some pictures around your hotends and share here?
Are the cooling fans on your printers are running all the time or not?

Shelton
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Re: Clog or heat creep

Postby Shelton » Wed Apr 08, 2020 8:24 am

Hahaha. Are you kidding? After two years? That is company procedure? BAD DESIGN nothing more. I tried in two years hundreds of brands. Idea Maker is now ready but at premiere time it wasn't. Cooling fans are working good. That is not cooling. Heat sink and throat tube don't have the right size to cool it down. Compare to the old model. Second, if you need disassembly right another posts above.

Please answer on my question: Why Raise company doesn't arrange service action to replace it all badly design hotends? Check new prices of PRO 2 you can buy it now for half of the price.... and compare to Ultimaker prices. Nothing to say more. Period.

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Vicky@Raise3D
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Re: Clog or heat creep

Postby Vicky@Raise3D » Fri Apr 10, 2020 6:34 pm

The hotend/nozzle has been carefully engineered and thoroughly tested through thousands upon thousands of printing on our end. And each printer has been tested a few days before packing up. We understand defects may exist in some cases, but you will need to provide us more information so that we can help. 

Shelton
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Re: Clog or heat creep

Postby Shelton » Fri Apr 10, 2020 6:59 pm

We talking about new replacement parts. Right installed... by skilled person - I'm a technician from the automotive industry and machine solutions for food industry. I'm working also with 3D software to project parts.

I used your manual because I was only working with documentation. The best part... I installed 0.6 nozzles. Last nozzle 0.4 was replaced a few times for check. With 0.6 is working without clogging. So we still talk about bad design still. Time to say it. You can read here on the forum also. That setup is BAD or VERY BAD. The question is why you don't replace it?! The answer is simple MONEY.

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Vicky@Raise3D
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Re: Clog or heat creep

Postby Vicky@Raise3D » Sat Apr 11, 2020 1:15 am

It is not replaced because the design has not changed for the entire lifespan of this product. We have tons of users owning this printer can print with no issue with default settings and original hardware on their printers. PLA is one of the most common matterials used on the machine and there are prebuilt templates made by filament manufacturers for our machine that print with stock parts. There are many factors can cause print failure. For example, bad settings will be the one which sometimes may need you drop bed temp or lower motor current.
If you feel the issue you are dealing with is related to hardware defects not setting, you can reach to our support team at http://help.raise3d.com to help you diagonise and process RMA for you when necessary.

Shelton
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Re: Clog or heat creep

Postby Shelton » Sat Apr 11, 2020 10:28 am

I tried your filament also. Always after a few hours, heat creeps. I used your settings. I was changing settings a thousand times. I used different software. I was change printing heads for new parts from your stock - a few times. I was made adjustments with bed levelling or cooling fans also. NOTHING. After some time clog. Always filament was expanded between nozzle and throat tube... heat creeps. Size of the radiator or main fan efficiency is too low. I was made new air duct for it and move side material fans outside. Is better... but only better.

Maintenance is a pain no modular parts... everywhere electric harness. No fast solutions. That machine is badly designed. Compare to other brands if you don't want to talk with me. If your filament clog you need also remove badly designed filament sensor. Often you need to push out filament from it... is not easy.

Software is now good I wrote about it above... but now is good... before well... now quality of prints is almost perfect. But at beginning NOT.

You should repair those issues or send money back for not working solutions. This is not a cheap toy from the supermarket. Think about it. I'm not ALONE with it. So it will be the light of the end of tunnel or NOT?

Markus64
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Location: Germany

Re: Clog or heat creep

Postby Markus64 » Mon Apr 13, 2020 9:42 am

@Shelton 100%!

Shelton
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Re: Clog or heat creep

Postby Shelton » Mon Apr 13, 2020 9:53 am

So what is your answer Raise? Any ideas to pay customers for their patience?

tja
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Location: Essex, UK

Re: Clog or heat creep

Postby tja » Mon Apr 13, 2020 1:02 pm

Shelton have you considered that 3D printing may not be ready for you yet? These are very early days for FDM technology and we are a very long way from plug & play. There are no 3D printer manufacturers that have all the answers today, the best any one of them can achieve is 'just about okay', so every user has to figure it out for themselves.

Having said that, I think Raise3D is doing a good job. I have owned an N1 since October 2016 and use it nearly every day in my business. Sure I have spent money on upgrading it as improvements have come along, but that was because I could and not because I needed to. 3 years on and I don't see any printers on the market that are significantly better, yet there are plenty that are worse. I have put in countless hours understanding and experimenting with 3D printing and at this point I would rate my skill level at about a 3 out of 5

The bottom line here is that you have bought into an experimental technology. You can either invest the time in learning how to solve the problems you're having and print parts consistently, or wait for 5 to 10 years for the technology to mature. Good luck with whichever path you choose.

Shelton
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Re: Clog or heat creep

Postby Shelton » Mon Apr 13, 2020 1:13 pm

Are you kidding?

Not ready? Is kind of joke compare to other brands. I have machine with new hotends without issue. Maybe I’m not ready for that kind of bad quality product... but I’m fight with it 2 years. Without spectacular success. Now after changing nozzles from 0.4 to 0.6 everything looks to work. So that is another proof for that is something wrong with factory setup. For that price level printing head should to be modular or easy to maintenance but is NOT.

But what about other issues? Battery issue? Clutch issue? What about that. What about paper filter? You need to replace it with air fan.... and that is not fast maintenance any way? What about that. Who is not ready? Be honest with me.

Shelton
Posts: 405
Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2018 8:34 pm

Re: Clog or heat creep

Postby Shelton » Tue Apr 14, 2020 8:36 am

And something new and fresh and proof about all above, new bigger throat tubes heatsinks or radiators.... so... new perfect printing head modification...?!!!

As you see bellow radiator is now bigger... but doesn't fit... that is part for PRO so you change something anyway, isn't it? Bigger is new. But in the old design, I can't mount it.

IMG_8240.jpeg

IMG_8239.jpeg

IMG_8238.jpeg

IMG_8237.jpeg

IMG_8236.jpeg

mdana
Posts: 92
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Re: Clog or heat creep

Postby mdana » Fri Apr 17, 2020 9:42 am

I ended up solving the problem by water cooling the heat sinks.
Attachments
56F39730-A88E-43E8-89BF-FA960C63004A.jpeg

Shelton
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Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2018 8:34 pm

Re: Clog or heat creep

Postby Shelton » Fri Apr 17, 2020 9:46 am

Cool but who was paying for it?

Markus64
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Location: Germany

Re: Clog or heat creep

Postby Markus64 » Sat Apr 18, 2020 4:15 pm

@mdana
Would you please tell me more about your water cooling here? I'm also upset about the original hotends and looking for working alternatives. Water cooling is probably the most effective cooling method. I would be interested in how you put this into practice.

mdana
Posts: 92
Joined: Mon Oct 07, 2019 1:36 am

Re: Clog or heat creep

Postby mdana » Sun Apr 19, 2020 2:26 am

I’m using E3D’s water cooling kit (https://e3d-online.com/water-cooling-kit) and printed (DMLS) the water blocks out of aluminum. There’s more info on water cooling in this thread: https://forum.raise3d.com/viewtopic.php?t=10787

Shelton
Posts: 405
Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2018 8:34 pm

Re: Clog or heat creep

Postby Shelton » Thu May 21, 2020 8:12 pm

After switching to 0.6 mm nozzles everything works very well. So the answer is simple. Bad construction design. No magical settings. What we do with it Raise. Time to say the truth. Sorry.


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