How THIN a layers have you been successful with?

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MDVolle
Posts: 56
Joined: Fri Oct 20, 2017 9:00 pm
Location: Fullerton CA

How THIN a layers have you been successful with?

Postby MDVolle » Thu Jul 05, 2018 11:47 pm

I have been trying to push the overhang limits w/o using supports - especially to finish the upper portion of round holes placed horizontally in parts.

To try and manage that, I have been using a 0.6 mm nozzle and using thin layers to help with the staggered layers around the holes.

I seem to be able to print 0.10 layers without any problem.

Using 0.08 layers works some of the time but flow rate/over extrusion seems to become an issue.

At 0.05 mm layers, nothing seems quite right - it looks like its over extruding and while vertical surfaces can look fantastic, getting the flow rate down to a working level is a challenge -

Vase mode objects seem fine - even at 0.03 mm but there, over extruding really wouldn't show up except as a slightly thicker wall.

I've been using Ryno Pro filament for testing and temperature seems less critical with this filament - it seems to extrude thin layers as low as 216C and as high as 250C but thinner layers seem to print better a little cooler than thicker layers - unfortunately, at lower temps, the sharp corners of overhung parts seem to round even more - increasing temperature fills them out better.

Any Thoughts?

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Jiter
Posts: 22
Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2018 6:14 am
Location: Germany

Re: How THIN a layers have you been successful with?

Postby Jiter » Fri Jul 06, 2018 1:13 pm

Hello,
I can add some Information and Pictures to that issue.

I tried to print the same Models with different Layerheights in one build. So there where the same Material, Temperatures and Settings besides Layerheight.

So I have made the same experience and would like to master this!
Attachments
IMG_20180706_150649.jpg
IMG_20180706_150654.jpg
Cheers, David
If you can dream it, you can print it! :lol:

MDVolle
Posts: 56
Joined: Fri Oct 20, 2017 9:00 pm
Location: Fullerton CA

Re: How THIN a layers have you been successful with?

Postby MDVolle » Sat Jul 07, 2018 1:20 am

I have printed some 0.05 mm layer pieces in my post "Artifacts" and they are all remarkably smooth but show small issues so I got bold and tried to print a part that I really wanted to get a clean print with nice finishes because I have mostly finished playing with the design and wanted a nice one - the working copies are fine but some of them were printed very fast with huge layers and a 0.6 mm nozzle - layers are very evident but it doesn't impact the actual use.

I tried printing the final in RYNO PRO at 0.05 layers with a 0.6 nozzle and it was a beautiful in some areas and a totally melty, sagging mess in other areas.

I created a small shape to try and explore what was happening after a few quick re=starts on the real part showed that I wasn't solving the problems.

This shape really can't be finished perfectly without support, but that was the point - see how far up the curve I could get.
These three only differ in layer height and flow rate - two being at 100% and one at 90% - as marked.

You can see the corners rounding and these are all at the same temp and fan arrangement

_DSC0775.JPG

_DSC0776.JPG

_DSC0777.JPG


Of course, there were many other combinations and settings tried;
_DSC0774.JPG


I got the "cleanest" print at very low temp (216C) and a 78% flow but it was very rounded on the corners.

The fullest corners is around 238C and 100% flow but that doesn't reach as far up the curve before sagging

Just changing layer height seems to have more material/higher flow than the same percentage at thicker layers.
I suspect that this could be a slight offset in the extruder calibration and the thinner layers make it more obvious?

I was gaging the flow based on when the nozzle started to push around "excess" on the surface - not an exact test for flow but if the flow was too high, it pushed around excess until it formed a goober somewhere on the perimeter of the part but reducing the flow until it didn't bulldoze any material around left very rounded out corners - especially where they were being printed as overhang.

I also wonder if the ration of nozzle diameter to layer thickness becomes critical?
Would very thin layers work better with very small nozzles? That would defeat my goal of printing overhanging layers further out but using the fat nozzle but there may be a correlation - More to print and try....

Mark


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