wipe wall

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Behold
Posts: 39
Joined: Sat Dec 02, 2017 3:59 am

wipe wall

Postby Behold » Wed May 02, 2018 3:02 pm

Does the wipe wall only happen in certain circumstances?

I am trying to get it to be propagated during the support and no setting I make will make it show?

Jetguy
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Location: In a van, down by the river

Re: wipe wall

Postby Jetguy » Wed May 02, 2018 3:15 pm

Only when some type of dual extrusion.
If you are using same material support- that does not use a wipe wall.

The whole reason the wipe wall exists is that the nozzles move together and so the unused nozzle at the time may ooze and when it does, it's also potentially crossing over the printed object layer while the other nozzle is printing. The idea is that the wipe wall catches this ooze, and then also is a structure so that repriming that other nozzle when required for the layer has a structure not on the print to catch up for the lost ooze. Just trying to explain, the ooze wall has a lot of purpose and is sued for a lot of reasons to solve issues of typical dual extrusion.

Behold
Posts: 39
Joined: Sat Dec 02, 2017 3:59 am

Re: wipe wall

Postby Behold » Wed May 02, 2018 3:35 pm

great info. Thanks!

Jetguy
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Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2016 1:40 am
Location: In a van, down by the river

Re: wipe wall

Postby Jetguy » Wed May 02, 2018 3:40 pm

Here is why you may no see a wipe wall.
The first general rule is left nozzle is primary and thus the general default.
If and when you turn on support from the simple menu (not showing the advanced full profile) support is also defaulting to the left nozzle and thus "same material support". Just means the support structure is the same plastic as the actual print.
Again, at this menu, what you do not see is by default, and only seen in the advance menu is that the support extruder defaults to left and that being the same default extruder for the object is "same support material".
Ideamakerprofilesimpleoptions.jpg


ONLY if you assign the support to the OTHER extruder (Right), then you are invoking dual extrusion and thus alternate material support where one plastic is the model the other is printed for the support structure.
You also have options from what i'm seeing, to say potentially make the tower structure of support same material, and then only use the other material (say some form of soluble or other support material) for the dense layers right before the actual object overhang layer.
IdeamakerSupport Extruder.jpg

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jetdillo
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Re: wipe wall

Postby jetdillo » Tue Jun 05, 2018 1:23 pm

Do I want to be using a Wipe-Wall as well as a Wipe Tower for dual extrusion?
I understand the purpose behind the Tower is to prime the nozzle during an extruder switch.
Seems like maybe I should be using both ?

Jetguy
Posts: 2649
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2016 1:40 am
Location: In a van, down by the river

Re: wipe wall

Postby Jetguy » Tue Jun 05, 2018 1:55 pm

jetdillo wrote:Do I want to be using a Wipe-Wall as well as a Wipe Tower for dual extrusion?
I understand the purpose behind the Tower is to prime the nozzle during an extruder switch.
Seems like maybe I should be using both ?


Correct, you want wipe wall too.
I would consider wipe tower "optional" and wipe wall as "required"

Just understand the purpose here:

Wipe wall prevents the non-printing nozzle at the time which can, does, and will ooze and there is not magical setting to prevent all ooze- from sticking in the very side face of your dual extrusion model. The only exception would be a model so small in any X direction, that the 25mm spacing the nozzles in X would never cross over your print. That's the only time wipe-wall is not needed, and that physically because the second nozzle will not cross over your print while the left nozzle is printing the far left edge of the print.

The Wipe Tower is a structure meant to further help purge and clean the nozzles from stray ooze drips, and being slightly away from the object, forces travel moves and thus longer layer time- good for cooling of small thin tall objects to prevent overheating.

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jetdillo
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Re: wipe wall

Postby jetdillo » Tue Jun 05, 2018 3:06 pm

Jetguy wrote:
jetdillo wrote:Do I want to be using a Wipe-Wall as well as a Wipe Tower for dual extrusion?
I understand the purpose behind the Tower is to prime the nozzle during an extruder switch.
Seems like maybe I should be using both ?


Correct, you want wipe wall too.
I would consider wipe tower "optional" and wipe wall as "required"

Just understand the purpose here:

Wipe wall prevents the non-printing nozzle at the time which can, does, and will ooze and there is not magical setting to prevent all ooze- from sticking in the very side face of your dual extrusion model. The only exception would be a model so small in any X direction, that the 25mm spacing the nozzles in X would never cross over your print. That's the only time wipe-wall is not needed, and that physically because the second nozzle will not cross over your print while the left nozzle is printing the far left edge of the print.

The Wipe Tower is a structure meant to further help purge and clean the nozzles from stray ooze drips, and being slightly away from the object, forces travel moves and thus longer layer time- good for cooling of small thin tall objects to prevent overheating.


Interesting. I'd always seen the Wipe Tower as a "scratchpad" to get the nozzle to start extruding fully again after being idle.
I'll turn them both on with my next print. Not sure why I didn't think to turn them both on together before now.
(maybe because getting dual-head printing going has been such a pain in the butt already ? :))

Jetguy
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Location: In a van, down by the river

Re: wipe wall

Postby Jetguy » Tue Jun 05, 2018 3:35 pm

The logic and reason is wipe wall also print first on each layer, and thus also serves as the "scratch pad" to prime the extruder and clear any bits stuck on it. That said, design of the wipe wall structure varies between slicers. Hate to even mention it, but MakerBot kind of pioneered some unique and noteworthy features in their wipe wall gcode, and being they are now owned by Stratasys and much of that IP is protected and patented- that's why you do not see other slicers just copying the functions.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J0bENwRFLnY

Some of those features were how one wall is one color/material and the other is the alternate.
Then another feature not seen in that video- the ends of the wipe wall had a corner structure that braced the wall much better.
Another related feature is the zig zag overlap crossing making the single vertical extrusion wall much better at not failing.
makerware wipe wall.jpg
Makerware same color support.png


It's sad, but again, I'm pretty sure these features are a "lost" thing to the community.
#1 that wipe wall only existed in older makerware versions- no longer officially hosted. According to what I'm seeing, even the new "Desktop" app uses a different variation, and so literally, this is a lost software specific version function.
#2 Makerware was intentionally coded to be hard or dfficult to hack to use other printers with it (protecting that IP and forcing you to buy a Makerbot)
#3 beyond that, the feature is likely patent protected- by the new owners- Stratasys.


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