Filament Run-out Sensor Add-on

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awolf
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Re: Filament Run-out Sensor Add-on

Postby awolf » Fri May 04, 2018 10:09 pm

Thanks Alex. I had rashly decided that that was the case, and it seems to be working... (have not tested the sensor yet though).

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Vicky@Raise3D
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Re: Filament Run-out Sensor Add-on

Postby Vicky@Raise3D » Sat May 05, 2018 5:24 pm

Please use the firmwares posted on Filament Run-out Sensor Installation Guide page for Filament Run-out Sensor.
https://www.raise3d.com/pages/filament- ... nstruction

kencfii
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Re: Filament Run-out Sensor Add-on

Postby kencfii » Wed May 09, 2018 6:09 pm

So has anyone tried this and see what happens when the printer runs out of filament?

Does it go to pause and then Home the heads?
Do you just load new filament as usual and then resume..

There has been some discussion here about what happens but I believe that was for aftermarket Home built units.

Just curious exactly what the raise firmware will do.

Got my run out sensor and thermal protector in the mail, hope to install soon.

Thanks

Perhaps a video?

Jetguy
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Re: Filament Run-out Sensor Add-on

Postby Jetguy » Wed May 09, 2018 6:26 pm

Same as you pressing pause on the screen. Understand that the DIY solution and the Raise 3D filament sensor do the same thing, work the same way because the RAISEPACK LCD firmware is what commands the pause, what controls the action. The mainboard is just following gcode.
All the FSR Marlin firmware version does is when that filament sensor also plugged into the endstop ports, just like the DIY solution triggers, then the mainboard sends to the LCD the pause gcode command. The LCD enters it's pause routine sending more gcode commands and stopping the print just as if you have touched the LCD and commanded a pause. Yes, you can run the load and unload filament just like any other pause.

Again, DIY solution and Raise 3D solution are the same thing. Yes, the sensor might be a different device, but the functionality by design is the same.

kencfii
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Re: Filament Run-out Sensor Add-on

Postby kencfii » Wed May 09, 2018 7:03 pm

Thank you very much for clarity

frjez
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Re: Filament Run-out Sensor Add-on

Postby frjez » Sun May 20, 2018 12:21 am

WOW!!! I just realize how expensive the F.Run-Out-Sensor is. 84€ for the sensor while the Main Controller board is 99,9€
This is just plain unfair! It's like buying a car tor 100 and then buying a spare tire for 30 :-(

DISAPPOINTED....

Anthonyvanv
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Re: Filament Run-out Sensor Add-on

Postby Anthonyvanv » Mon May 21, 2018 2:24 pm

is there any way to switch the sensor from LR to RL? Do I just switch the Y+ and Z+ wires? I don’t like that it is backwards.

Anthonyvanv
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Re: Filament Run-out Sensor Add-on

Postby Anthonyvanv » Mon May 21, 2018 3:18 pm

Also, Vicky, the runout sensor mount was 100% designed to mount to the top of the extruder.

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Vicky@Raise3D
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Re: Filament Run-out Sensor Add-on

Postby Vicky@Raise3D » Tue May 22, 2018 11:30 am

Anthonyvanv wrote:is there any way to switch the sensor from LR to RL? Do I just switch the Y+ and Z+ wires? I don’t like that it is backwards.


Switch the white and green cable on Y and Z terminals.

kencfii
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Re: Filament Run-out Sensor Add-on

Postby kencfii » Tue May 22, 2018 11:45 am

It did and it works :-)

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Vicky@Raise3D
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Re: Filament Run-out Sensor Add-on

Postby Vicky@Raise3D » Tue May 22, 2018 1:51 pm

Anthonyvanv wrote:Also, Vicky, the runout sensor mount was 100% designed to mount to the top of the extruder.


You are right that the original design of the part is designed to mount onto the top of the extruder. But after several tests, we found that the trigger didn't work properly every time and digged out that the issue should be related to too short distance for the software to react.
To improve the working accuracy, it will be more recommended to be installed above filament spools to ensure enough react time. We apologize for this confusion to you.

Iamkar33m
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Re: Filament Run-out Sensor Add-on

Postby Iamkar33m » Tue May 22, 2018 1:58 pm

Vicky@Raise3D wrote:
Anthonyvanv wrote:Also, Vicky, the runout sensor mount was 100% designed to mount to the top of the extruder.


You are right that the original design of the part is designed to mount onto the top of the extruder. But after several tests, we found that the trigger didn't work properly every time and digged out that the issue should be related to too short distance for the software to react.
To improve the working accuracy, it will be more recommended to be installed above filament spools to ensure enough react time. We apologize for this confusion to you.


So what does this mean for your new PRO models that have it above the extruder?

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Vicky@Raise3D
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Re: Filament Run-out Sensor Add-on

Postby Vicky@Raise3D » Wed May 23, 2018 7:33 am

Iamkar33m wrote:
Vicky@Raise3D wrote:
You are right that the original design of the part is designed to mount onto the top of the extruder. But after several tests, we found that the trigger didn't work properly every time and digged out that the issue should be related to too short distance for the software to react.
To improve the working accuracy, it will be more recommended to be installed above filament spools to ensure enough react time. We apologize for this confusion to you.


So what does this mean for your new PRO models that have it above the extruder?


The Pro2 series printers are not using the same firmware as N series printers, which doesn't include this issue. So on Pro2 series, the Filament Run-out sensor is installed above extruder by default.

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JohnSays
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Re: Filament Run-out Sensor Add-on

Postby JohnSays » Wed May 23, 2018 2:04 pm

Using N2 with R3D filament monitor and 1.1.6-frs.

I have had this happen the only two times I have run out of filament mid-print: The printhead does not resume where it left off. Instead it resumes about 20 mm from where it left off. At first I thought that it simply was not extruding immediately, but the second time I saw plainly that it positioned itself about 20 mm from the point it ended off and started extruding almost immediately -- there was a very small lag before the filament came out. See picture below. When I manually pause, I do not see this 20 mm gap.

IMG_8046.JPG
- John
2 Raise3D N2 Duals, V2 nozzles, Bondtech BMGs, adjustable table, Panucatt SD2224 drivers

Jetguy
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Re: Filament Run-out Sensor Add-on

Postby Jetguy » Wed May 23, 2018 4:01 pm

I would be really curious to see if there there any difference in the result of the open source community made FSR firmware VS the Raise 3D FSR firmware. The Raise 3D sensor should work with both, it might just take a little testing to understand the correct options within the open source firmware. I say this because it's a simple matter of binary state. Either the sensor line is high or low, compared to filament present VS filament out. The open source firmware variant supports either combination (N.0. VS N.C.) logic or switch config.

Based on what you are saying, it appears to be how the triggered event is handled. Example would be, one lets the motion planner complete the last 16 planned segments in the buffer, the other method kills it at the buffer thus why you might see a loss of what is likely the 16 segments. I say this because you are printing a curve. A curve is not a curve in current gcode,it's a polygon, so that segment looks in my opinion to be about what I expect to match the known 16 segment buffer.
I think key understanding, is, you presented the best possible scenario. If you were printing infill- especially infill without any coast enabled, then that could be 16 lines of infill skipped.

I think this warrants more detailed technical testing. In truth, this has nothing to do with the sensor itself and everything to do with the firmware. The sensor just kicks off the event- what happens next is all firmware logic between the raise touch and Marlin.

Jab136
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Re: Filament Run-out Sensor Add-on

Postby Jab136 » Thu May 24, 2018 1:10 pm

I installed the sensor yesterday, and already encountered a print failure directly caused by the tolerance on the pass through being too tight. a small imperfection in the filament caused it to be completely impossible to pull the filament any further, even by hand. Additionally, the added feed resistance from the sensor made it so that I had to increase the voltage of the drivers for the bondtech extruder in order to avoid skipped steps.

kencfii
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Re: Filament Run-out Sensor Add-on

Postby kencfii » Thu May 24, 2018 1:31 pm

I had similar issues but no feed failures.
I noticed the drag on the filament is way too strong.
It is from the crazy angle that the tubes have to bend when you mount the sensor on the printer. It actually bends and creases the Bowden tubes.
How do I know this?
I removed my sensor because of this and noticed the tubes were creased.

Raise sent me a file to print of a new design of the mounting block. It seems better but I have yet to mount it. When I took my sensor apart to put the newly printed mounting block apart, a piece was broken off the sensor board. I am hoping they send me another one soon. I will then try to re mount the sensor with the new design mounting block that I printed.
It does seem to shallow the angle on the tubes so it may work but I have to wait for the sensor.

I have been impressed with the raise 3d so far but this sensor seems to be a bit of a debacle. It causes way too much drag on the filament, installing it can be tough because of this and it damages the Bowden tubes. Also the instructions want us to switch the left and right spool feeding, so the left spool is for the right extruded and the right for the left extruded, which to me, makes no sense, but you can fix this by switching the way the 2 wires from the sensor are attached to the main board

Jab136
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Re: Filament Run-out Sensor Add-on

Postby Jab136 » Thu May 24, 2018 1:33 pm

I actually notice the drag even without the tubes attached, it is an inherent property of the sensor itself. I currently have the sensor mounted off to the side with short segments of filament in both of the feed paths so it is basically disabled without having to uninstall it entirely...


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