E3D v6 Adaptor

Topics around mechanical design, controller and electronics. Mods & hacks welcome.
benny32
Posts: 20
Joined: Tue Jun 21, 2016 2:42 am

Re: E3D v6 Adaptor

Postby benny32 » Sun Jan 14, 2018 11:15 pm

Sorry, I have both thermocouples in, just have single e3d adapter. Won't use second raise3d end and it's shorter so not in the way. Both are hooked up though.

trae@greenlee.cc
Posts: 72
Joined: Sat Nov 25, 2017 4:31 pm

Re: E3D v6 Adaptor

Postby trae@greenlee.cc » Sun Jan 14, 2018 11:46 pm

Ah,
Assuming the termalcoupler is ok, check the polarity if its wires.

firesped
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Re: E3D v6 Adaptor

Postby firesped » Mon Jan 15, 2018 1:10 am

If you hook the wires in backwards, it will read the temperature backwards and cause the error.
RL name: Michael Nolen
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trae@greenlee.cc
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Re: E3D v6 Adaptor

Postby trae@greenlee.cc » Mon Jan 15, 2018 4:13 pm

updated assembly guide to include answers to some of the questions asked since initial guide.
https://goo.gl/x4ZFWE

firesped
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Re: E3D v6 Adaptor

Postby firesped » Mon Jan 15, 2018 4:35 pm

I am wondering about the PTFE tube. I actually found that here is space between the adapter and the other tube that things might get caught on. Not sure if you can flare the top of the adapter.
RL name: Michael Nolen
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trae@greenlee.cc
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Re: E3D v6 Adaptor

Postby trae@greenlee.cc » Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:04 pm

Not sure what you're describing. please elaborate.

firesped
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Re: E3D v6 Adaptor

Postby firesped » Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:27 pm

I was printed ePC with the new hotend. then I went to print with Polysmooth. I found the polysmooth needed the hotend cleaned after using the ePC since ePC prints at a much higher temperature. residue from the ePC was damaging the polysmooth as it extruded. I think i sorta clogged the hotend because I didn't think about clearing the polysmooth which was not designed for the higher temperature. so I went to guitar center and ace and picked up some guitar strings. 15 gauge is .38mm. and some music wire from ace that was 55 gauge. while poking the music wire down into the hotend, I was hitting the top of the adapter. It wasn't going into the hole exactly. esun cleaning filament is pretty soft stuff, I think it was having issues getting into the hole as well. I haven't had issues with anything else yet.
RL name: Michael Nolen
printers:
raise3D N2 kickstarter Early Bird
Trinus Deluxe (running smoothieware on Azteeg X5 GT board)
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trae@greenlee.cc
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Re: E3D v6 Adaptor

Postby trae@greenlee.cc » Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:53 pm

Recommend going with something closer to 1.75 for poking around from extruder side of the toolhead.
iirc some wire was provided with the N2 just for this purpose.
The flairing i believe you are asking for is describe in the guide, see the section regarding PTFE tube installation. Snip "Finally flare the entrance of the PTFE tube with an awl or other suitable tool."
I have run three spools of ninja flex (85 durometer) through mine with out issues either extruding or loading. Note i use .8mm nozzle for flex and bondtech extruder.
If you haven't flared PTFE tube do so and be sure heatsink body is all the way up into tool head.
If there is still a gap between Heatsink and tool head R3D PTFE liner there are two ways to address that come to mind.
Install a longer PTFE tube in heatsink or push R3D liner down and shim to hold in place if needed.

Side note, I use scrap taluman bridge nylon for cleaning/clearing all metal nozzles via the cold pull method. ~$15 bucks a lb and will last for years if your just using for cold pulls.

leseaw
Posts: 8
Joined: Mon Aug 21, 2017 5:10 pm

Re: E3D v6 Adaptor

Postby leseaw » Wed Jan 17, 2018 12:16 pm

which. stls are now recommended?
For component and hotend cooling.

trae@greenlee.cc
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Re: E3D v6 Adaptor

Postby trae@greenlee.cc » Wed Jan 17, 2018 12:59 pm

without knowing what additional fans you may have and assuming v6 heaterblock i would recommend stock air diverter or 35mm axial fan shroud.v1.2

anime_fan
Posts: 13
Joined: Fri Feb 23, 2018 11:20 pm

Re: E3D v6 Adaptor

Postby anime_fan » Mon Feb 26, 2018 8:27 pm

what is the weight difference between the assembled e3d and the stock hot end?

trae@greenlee.cc
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Re: E3D v6 Adaptor

Postby trae@greenlee.cc » Mon Feb 26, 2018 8:35 pm

weight 24gr vs 30gr R3Dv2 (cold end,heat break,hot end, and nozzle only)

firesped
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Re: E3D v6 Adaptor

Postby firesped » Mon Feb 26, 2018 8:57 pm

I have a really good setup with my current design but it only works with the volcano. I ordered 40mm x 40mm x 20 mm blower fan to redesign it. I am hoping that it will allow me to create a unit that can cool both hotends.
RL name: Michael Nolen
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trae@greenlee.cc
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Re: E3D v6 Adaptor

Postby trae@greenlee.cc » Mon Feb 26, 2018 9:05 pm

Have a look at this layer cooling solution.
http://www.themakerhive.com/shop/viewitem.php?productid=45
Might be an answer to layer cooing without trying to shoehorn in a big blower.

firesped
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Re: E3D v6 Adaptor

Postby firesped » Mon Feb 26, 2018 11:03 pm

the 40mm is actually a smaller fan then the part is currently.
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Iamkar33m
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Joined: Fri Dec 01, 2017 2:53 pm

Re: E3D v6 Adaptor

Postby Iamkar33m » Sat Mar 10, 2018 8:02 am

Due to popular request, here are the STL files for my cooling design. I do not have a thingiverse account, otherwise I'd post it up there.

Beware that after running this for a couple months, a few issues have surfaced:

1) The heatblocks melt the tip of the blower air diverters, it doesn't touch but it's close enough to deform PLA.
2) While doing a large print (most of the print bed area), the blowers struck the printbed cable chain (breaking the bracket).

Both these issues can probably be resolved by printing in a higher temp/durable material (ABS or PETG or Nylon). Though the blowers hitting the cable chain is probably not a good thing... just be mindful of builds that get close to the rear right area of the bed.

Best,
Kareem
Attachments
rh-cold-end.stl
(882.41 KiB) Downloaded 59 times
lh-cold-end.stl
(882.5 KiB) Downloaded 58 times
nozzle.stl
(65.12 KiB) Downloaded 59 times
fan-bracket.stl
(123.91 KiB) Downloaded 49 times

FreedomRules
Posts: 46
Joined: Thu Jan 25, 2018 4:34 pm

Re: E3D v6 Adaptor

Postby FreedomRules » Tue Apr 03, 2018 11:56 pm

So i recently did this upgrade with titanium heatbreak and E3D copper block on both heads. I purchased all other parts through Filastruder including 2 new Type K Thermocouple cartridges. I assumed I'd have to do some form of calibration so I thought i'd check with a known good temp tool. I have FieldPiece ST4 temp gauge I had purchased when I installed my new HVAC system. I'm finding that the temperature is reporting at 200C when in fact its 193C. Is there any way to do an offset / calibration without having to do something like using a resistor to manual offset the values being reported? I've done the PID autotune at 230C on the Left unit. I can't select the right for autotune as it just says left with no selection option but I believe I read somewhere current firmware doesn't support controlling them separately. I'm running 1.1.8ABH firmware. Any input would be appreciated.

Jetguy
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Re: E3D v6 Adaptor

Postby Jetguy » Wed Apr 04, 2018 1:40 am

Look, I know that you think you are doing the right thing, using a meter to calibrate, but put the meter down, and worry about other things.
You are talking 7C here. you can swear all day what you measured, a thermocouple is accurate to +-3C. So if one read high and one read low, one was internal inside the heater block and one was touching the outside, 7C is about as accurate as you could expect for a spot check.

No, short of custom compiling new math into the firmware, that's not an offset you can or should adjust. The way this works is #1 the AD597 thermocouple amp is a laser trimmed factory calibrated IC. That chip actually has multiple internal calibrated temp sensors, since the basic premise of measuring a thermocouple is that the hot tip and the cold joint at the screw terminal represent the difference. So, the internal function is it takes the calibrated known temp of the chip itself, that is then assumed to be the same temp as the screw terminals, and then adds the difference it's measuring of the hot end compared to the screw terminals. Then it outputs a simple DC voltage that is proportional to the temp (10mV per degree C starting at 0). So 0C is 0V. 100C is 1.00V. 500C would be 5.00V. http://www.analog.com/media/en/technica ... 96_597.pdf That voltage is carried over the ribbon cable to the mainboard into the analog input of the mega 2560. The internal ADC conversion converts that 0-5V signal using the reverse math (10mV = 1C). This is why I said you would have to change the math, it is NOT a lookup table as seen with the complex curves that happen with thermistors.

Point being, you calibrate custom temps for a filament based on results. So who cares if it's 7C off? And that's my other point, I doubt it's 7C off, more like 3 at most and the rest was error in measurement. You tune to an arbitrary value anyway. In other words, a filament spool might say 200-220C for that filament recommended starting point. You print some calibration prints like overhang and other tests to find the ideal temp for your system anyway, and that's a new number.

FreedomRules
Posts: 46
Joined: Thu Jan 25, 2018 4:34 pm

Re: E3D v6 Adaptor

Postby FreedomRules » Wed Apr 04, 2018 4:11 pm

Jetguy wrote:Look, I know that you think you are doing the right thing, using a meter to calibrate, but put the meter down, and worry about other things.
You are talking 7C here. you can swear all day what you measured, a thermocouple is accurate to +-3C. So if one read high and one read low, one was internal inside the heater block and one was touching the outside, 7C is about as accurate as you could expect for a spot check.

No, short of custom compiling new math into the firmware, that's not an offset you can or should adjust. The way this works is #1 the AD597 thermocouple amp is a laser trimmed factory calibrated IC. That chip actually has multiple internal calibrated temp sensors, since the basic premise of measuring a thermocouple is that the hot tip and the cold joint at the screw terminal represent the difference. So, the internal function is it takes the calibrated known temp of the chip itself, that is then assumed to be the same temp as the screw terminals, and then adds the difference it's measuring of the hot end compared to the screw terminals. Then it outputs a simple DC voltage that is proportional to the temp (10mV per degree C starting at 0). So 0C is 0V. 100C is 1.00V. 500C would be 5.00V. http://www.analog.com/media/en/technica ... 96_597.pdf That voltage is carried over the ribbon cable to the mainboard into the analog input of the mega 2560. The internal ADC conversion converts that 0-5V signal using the reverse math (10mV = 1C). This is why I said you would have to change the math, it is NOT a lookup table as seen with the complex curves that happen with thermistors.

Point being, you calibrate custom temps for a filament based on results. So who cares if it's 7C off? And that's my other point, I doubt it's 7C off, more like 3 at most and the rest was error in measurement. You tune to an arbitrary value anyway. In other words, a filament spool might say 200-220C for that filament recommended starting point. You print some calibration prints like overhang and other tests to find the ideal temp for your system anyway, and that's a new number.


Thanks for the response JetGuy. I agree that you can have variance in measurements. I go overboard sometimes trying to make things exact. I didn't think about the fact I could just do a conversion on the measured voltage on the existing thermocouple I didn't know it had its own internal calibrated measurement procedure. I guess if the ribbon cable is carrying the voltage to the main board the that will likely attribute to the additional temp loss as I'm sure there formula didn't account for voltage drop by calculating the distance between sensor and board while accounting for the number of connections and different gauge wire used to transfer that voltage signal. Considering I've also seen posts where users are saying that ribbon cable tends to go bad. Guessing its likely to small of a gauge of wire for the voltage being carried so the connections possible overheat and deteriorate over time.

Jetguy
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Re: E3D v6 Adaptor

Postby Jetguy » Wed Apr 04, 2018 4:15 pm

Actually no, there is zero current. That's the thing to understand, resistance affects current, not voltage.
A 1 meg resistor to a voltage, is still the exact same voltage at both sides. The ADC inputs of the mega2560 processor at the mainboard are extremely high impedance. Basically you are charging a tiny capacitor. There is no measurable current. As such, there is no voltage lost and that's part of the issue, why the protection board is a must, why we had a fault the other day, why I made the videos that show you can unplug the cable in operation and the voltage does not even drop.


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