Project Bondtech Extruder

Topics around mechanical design, controller and electronics. Mods & hacks welcome.
lami3d
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Re: Project Bondtech Extruder

Postby lami3d » Wed Jan 18, 2017 5:02 pm

and ngen flex is hard to sitck to buildplate even with 10brims on the buildtack... (i've printed the flexy-hand2 and experienced a little bit warping after 5h... the fingers went well).

i haven't tried raft and glue on buildtack yet...

flexrc
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Re: Project Bondtech Extruder

Postby flexrc » Sat Jan 28, 2017 7:17 am

lami3d wrote:Tx thruster
so, it's the same brand but not the same material...
ninjaflex is simply callled ninjaflex ? and "cheetah" a ninjaflex version more easy to print with ?

are there some tips to print with ? i've only tried ngenflex in flexible materials...


I'm having very good success with semiflex and cheetah, which is a bit less soft, so you can print a bit faster with it.

Right extruder is a bit of a pain, but works.

lami3d wrote:and ngen flex is hard to sitck to buildplate even with 10brims on the buildtack... (i've printed the flexy-hand2 and experienced a little bit warping after 5h... the fingers went well).

i haven't tried raft and glue on buildtack yet...


buildtack is such a scam. I find that best way to print is directly on the glass and for other filaments I just use glue, works like a charm.

lami3d
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Re: Project Bondtech Extruder

Postby lami3d » Sat Jan 28, 2017 5:51 pm

Tx flexrc !

it's just that colorfabb seems to insist on the importance of printing ngenflex on buildtak
i print everything on glass but, this time, i prefered to use buildtak cause i've read their instructions before printing...
buildtak manage to place their product everywhere with good reviews but, even if it works, it's not perfect and it's expensive...

i'm trying recreus filaflex now and i've to fight against stringing with the benchy boat !

i'm also thinking about flowrate : do i have to consider that the "lines" of a same (top) layer must stay stuck when i stretched on a part ? (flowrate about 115%/120%) or is it normal that they unstick from each other when the part is stretched ? (flowrate about 100%)
i prefer increase the flowrate but i'm not sure that it's the correct way to print a flex filament

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JohnSays
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Re: Project Bondtech Extruder

Postby JohnSays » Sun Jan 29, 2017 9:56 pm

I can address the sticking: All layers should stick to each other even under strong stretching. To get a decent print with Nijaflex I had to really slow it up. I think my max speed was 15. In S3D I printed all parts at 15 mm/sec at 245 using 0.40 nozzle
- John
Raise3D N2 Dual, V2 nozzles, Bondtech hybrid mod, and adjustable table

lami3d
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Re: Project Bondtech Extruder

Postby lami3d » Mon Jan 30, 2017 10:03 pm

Thank you John for your explanations and help !
I'm on understanding this and i'm about 120% for global flowrate and i think it's interesting to set 120% (or more) on the infill rate using "rectilinear" infill (it sticks the infill layers well in this pattern, like the "line" one but faster).

my experience : i manage to print the Tobee BMX grip (for example) quickly (about 40mm/s and 230 with filaflex) because there is no gap in this part and the printhead can stay "inside" the part (--> no string) (settings : tick --> no retract inside part, no travelling through holes and nearest start point)

but it still a pain to print the benchy boat without any single string... i 'm about to think that it's impossible until i don't use a flextruder...
i can't print all the flexyfingers in the same time with filaflex 'cause of the strings but i can print all the fingers and the hand in the same time with ngenflex

when the part(s) do(es)n't include gap(s), it's """""very""""" simple t print (filaflex, ngen, flexifil...) but it's difficult to fight against oozing/stringing when the printed part includes gaps...

flexrc
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Re: Project Bondtech Extruder

Postby flexrc » Wed Feb 01, 2017 11:39 pm

Guiding tube on right extruder started to come out from the holding mechanism, nothing seems to help to keep it there. Do you know about any easy fix for it?

firesped
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Re: Project Bondtech Extruder

Postby firesped » Thu Feb 02, 2017 4:00 pm

you need to heat it up so it expands to fill. personally I think if I could modify some of the designs, I would add the quick releases, like are found on the printers versus the current design.
RL name: Michael Nolen

flexrc
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Re: Project Bondtech Extruder

Postby flexrc » Fri Feb 03, 2017 7:53 am

firesped wrote:you need to heat it up so it expands to fill. personally I think if I could modify some of the designs, I would add the quick releases, like are found on the printers versus the current design.


You are right, it looks like this tube shrunk that filament can hardly move inside of it, so outside diameter decreased and can simply slide off from this mechanism. I thought that this material should take high temperatures?

I keep thinking that design needs modifications. I will also prefer to have two extruders together, because this bowden one makes life unnecessary complicated.
Do you have a picture of this quick release?

firesped
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Re: Project Bondtech Extruder

Postby firesped » Fri Feb 03, 2017 9:12 pm

These in the red box.

12645079_1172546252756327_7661455733952656733_n.jpg
RL name: Michael Nolen

flexrc
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Re: Project Bondtech Extruder

Postby flexrc » Mon Apr 10, 2017 9:58 pm

just as firesped has suggested I've modified Bondtech extruder lid design to take push-in fitting:
http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2240787

hope that it will help to somebody
Attachments
IMG_8140.JPG

itehlab
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Joined: Thu May 26, 2016 12:56 pm

Re: Project Bondtech Extruder

Postby itehlab » Wed Apr 12, 2017 7:37 am

Hey everyone, sorry for jumping into a thread without reading the whole thing first, but I have a quick question: does the Bondtech extruder fit on the first Raise3D N2 printers that were sent as part of the Kickstarter campaign? I’m talking about the single extruder version and the first versions of N2 printers (without reset button and without isolation on heated beds). Did anyone have any issues installing the Bondtech extruder on those first versions?

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Trhuster
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Re: Project Bondtech Extruder

Postby Trhuster » Wed Apr 12, 2017 12:04 pm

The only thing you need to check if you have a Casted (rev 1) or a CNC-milled (rev 2) housing. Check the pic's in this link: http://shop.bondtech.se/ec/upgrade-kits ... ybrid.html

itehlab
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Re: Project Bondtech Extruder

Postby itehlab » Thu Apr 13, 2017 2:18 pm

Great, thanks for your quick answer. We just ordered one, can't wait to get it!

photoholic
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Re: Project Bondtech Extruder

Postby photoholic » Sat Apr 15, 2017 3:20 pm

Hi there everybody

just got a complete Bondtech hybrid kit installed... direct drive is working fine but no chance to get the Bowden working. I put the step correction lines in both gcode-tabs in IdeaMaker (1 extruder and 2 extruder).

If I start a print with support and want to print the support with the right extruder it seems like its underextruding and extrusion starts much too late. The left one is extruding in the initiation process before the print but almost nothing comes out of the right.
There's also all the time coming a little bit of material out of the right one and the little fillament pieces get mixed up with the materiel from the left one.

Is there anybody out there able to print dual color or support with two extruders? If yes I would be very grateful for a tipp and the Ideamaker configs.

Thanks a lot

John

socke
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Re: Project Bondtech Extruder

Postby socke » Sat Apr 15, 2017 3:44 pm

You need a custom firmware for dual extrusion with different E step values. There are different approaches out there, I recommend you to read some pages back...

photoholic
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Re: Project Bondtech Extruder

Postby photoholic » Sat Apr 15, 2017 3:57 pm

thanks a lot socke... will fight trough the pages immediately ;)

lami3d
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Re: Project Bondtech Extruder

Postby lami3d » Sat Apr 15, 2017 4:04 pm

Have you got both original raise3d motors on direct and bowden extruders ?

photoholic
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Re: Project Bondtech Extruder

Postby photoholic » Sat Apr 15, 2017 4:05 pm

hi lami3d... and yes... original motors...

photoholic
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Re: Project Bondtech Extruder

Postby photoholic » Sat Apr 15, 2017 4:21 pm

I guess I went through almost everything but don't get it. Do I need another firmware to print dual or not? Is this firmware form Raise3D or is that some sort of hack?

(meanwhile the directdrive got stuck after 2h of printing... motor is burning hot damn... not sure if I'm already regreting this upgrade)

lami3d
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Re: Project Bondtech Extruder

Postby lami3d » Sat Apr 15, 2017 4:21 pm

Hi (sorry)

I have not yet tested dual extrusion yet with bondtech (and maybe i'll never test it with raise) so i can't help you.
i had to test it with the original conf and i found that PVA left traces (one the part) that become holes after removing the PVA with water
it seemed like a gadget (but it's my first printer) and i would maybe choose a printer with 2 independent noozles (like bcn) if i needed dual extrusion

but i understood that that the E-steps are depending on the motors and so you need a customized firmware if you run one original motor and one bondtech motor... that's what i've understood.
maybe the g-code line need to be added after the command that switch from one extruder to the other (it's just an idea because i've not learnt g-code yet...).


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