good bottom layer

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firesped
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good bottom layer

Postby firesped » Tue Feb 14, 2017 4:13 pm

what are people doing to get a good bottom layer print?
RL name: Michael Nolen

Jetguy
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Re: good bottom layer

Postby Jetguy » Tue Feb 14, 2017 4:50 pm

Print on glass using aquanet hairspray. Also, you fine tune first layer height and level adjustment to get that "perfect" first layer.

Jetguy
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Re: good bottom layer

Postby Jetguy » Tue Feb 14, 2017 4:53 pm

FWIW I do it all the time for say LCD housings that the face is the bezel of the LCD. I clean my glass with alcohol to remove all previous hairspray and any impressions that may exist from previous prints. I spray the spray with nozzle no more than 3-4 inches away to control overspray with the bed heated to 80C to rapidly dry the layer. I put 3 thin coats rather than one thick coat. Basically when the glass looks frosted- it's ready to rock.

firesped
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Re: good bottom layer

Postby firesped » Tue Feb 14, 2017 7:10 pm

should I print without a raft? I'm not getting good results with the raft.
RL name: Michael Nolen

firesped
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Re: good bottom layer

Postby firesped » Tue Feb 14, 2017 7:19 pm

here is what I am looking at.

first print settings, .2mm layers, 25% infill. first layer is set to .18 at 15 mm/s, first layer flowrate 100% flowrate for the filament, PLA+ is set to 100%. Not using dense support layers.

Here is the first layer on top of the raft.
IMG_0755.JPG


Here is the top of the print.
IMG_0758.JPG


second print, cut the model to 20mm of the files. same settings but filament flowrate is set to 96%.

First layer on top of raft.
IMG_0756.JPG


top of print
IMG_0757.JPG
RL name: Michael Nolen

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walshlg
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Re: good bottom layer

Postby walshlg » Wed Feb 15, 2017 4:44 pm

rafts make the bottom rough, print only with a skirt or brim if you want it glass smooth

firesped
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Re: good bottom layer

Postby firesped » Wed Feb 15, 2017 4:52 pm

yeah, I found that information. not having good look printing on the glass with hairspray, going to try the buildtek side. my model has some weird shapes that are not printing correctly either. It's not laying out the shell correctly.
RL name: Michael Nolen

Jetguy
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Re: good bottom layer

Postby Jetguy » Wed Feb 15, 2017 7:13 pm

Sorry for such a late reply. Yes, I agree, I would not be using rafts. What bothered me more was the screen door effect on your very last picture you posted. By screen door, I mean the infill/roof or floor layers you posted in that last picture are spaced such that there are gaps and it's not a closed surface. That is a gcode path thing and that comes from the incorrect extrusion width value in the slicer (well at least one common way that happens). I mean in theory, if the layer height is such that the nozzle drools rather than presses the layer, we see this slightly, but your picture has much wider spacing than that type of error.
Screen door effect.JPG

If you are using S3D as a slicer, you should set extrusion width value from auto which sets it to 0.48mm to manual and 0.40 mm.
S3D extrusion width.jpg

Jetguy
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Re: good bottom layer

Postby Jetguy » Wed Feb 15, 2017 7:23 pm

In all my experience, this is one of a couple of things.
First, based on the screen door, again, the gcode paths being spaced is caused by the slicer thinking the extrusion width is greater than your nozzle is capable of producing and thus you get the paths the nozzle takes spaced and then resulting gaps.

But, if you had the worst backlash on the planet, say a loose belt that is sloppy loose, or say a shaft coupler that had snapped, then because infill is a back and forth motion, you would get severe backlash and lost motion. I don't think that's the case here because backlash often has a variable component to it making it more random. This is every single time based what I see on the couple of pictures. I don't think this is it, but a test is very easy. Simply use the control panel to jog the motors so that all axis are activated and thus locking. Then try to wiggle the extruder head in XY by hand. It should be very solid and unable to move (don't force it to skip steps, but reasonable force to see how much it deflects). A broken coupler or loose belt is normally very obvious under this test.

Under extrusion or a sloppy extruder that is marginal and doesn't grip the filament well or skips steps would cause some of the effect, but that looks totally different with skipped lines and super thin lines. Your prints show the extruder seems consistent, it's just something is causing the parallel lines of extrusion to not match up.

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walshlg
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Re: good bottom layer

Postby walshlg » Thu Feb 16, 2017 4:44 pm

dont forget to print the 2cm test cube 100% fill. IMHO that is what you need to do next.

firesped
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Re: good bottom layer

Postby firesped » Thu Feb 16, 2017 5:52 pm

I'm using ideamaker for my slicer.
RL name: Michael Nolen

firesped
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Re: good bottom layer

Postby firesped » Thu Feb 16, 2017 6:07 pm

did the test jetguy sugested by locking the extruder head in place, I centered it with the control panel. the shafts locked into belts were rock steady, there was a little give on the head, seemed like the shafts displacing slightly themselves.

I am running marlin firmware RC8-Bugfix.

I need to get a usb drive so I can pull up the serial log for the printer settings.
RL name: Michael Nolen

firesped
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Re: good bottom layer

Postby firesped » Thu Feb 16, 2017 6:10 pm

I measured a piece of filament scrap from a print start. it is showing .42 mm on my calipers.
RL name: Michael Nolen

firesped
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Re: good bottom layer

Postby firesped » Thu Feb 16, 2017 6:34 pm

could i be extruding too hot? I wonder if my insulation is having an effect on it.

I need to check something with my stepper setup.
RL name: Michael Nolen

firesped
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Re: good bottom layer

Postby firesped » Thu Feb 16, 2017 6:56 pm

it seems this may be what happens when you set the bondtech drivegear to 94 steps per unit instead of 140.
RL name: Michael Nolen

firesped
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Re: good bottom layer

Postby firesped » Thu Feb 16, 2017 7:22 pm

updated the firmware and it is printing how it should be. actually printing it on the buildtek without a raft. no skirt or brim.

lines are printing where they are suposed to be printed and the inflow is nice and tight. I need to do some calibration now that I have this issue fixed.
RL name: Michael Nolen

firesped
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Re: good bottom layer

Postby firesped » Thu Feb 16, 2017 10:56 pm

fixing that fixed the bottom but everything else is over extrudering now. i wonder if I should save off and share this part as a calibration part.
RL name: Michael Nolen

firesped
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Re: good bottom layer

Postby firesped » Fri Feb 17, 2017 7:38 pm

forgot to fix all the settings for my printer when I retuned the default firmware.

in case anyone else wants to try it, here is the link to the github repository for Marlin 1.1.0 RC8 BugFix. I need to check something. cause I got the firmware to work properly without having to jury-rig it. Looks like this build is the one that works correctly. I don't know if the RC has been updated with the issues that forces me to use RCBugFix at this time.

https://github.com/Firesped/Marlin/tree ... s-RCBugFix
RL name: Michael Nolen

lami3d
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Re: good bottom layer

Postby lami3d » Tue Feb 28, 2017 10:26 am

it's not a big surface but i find this one was really beautifull !
Colorfabb woodfill

20170228_105028.jpg


On glass bed (for every material), nozzle 0.2mm from the bed and -0.2mm z offset to get a 0.2mm first layer height (100%flowrate for first layer). You can adjust by the offset if necessary


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