XY Compensation Calibration

Discussions about ideaMaker and other printing software.
firesped
Posts: 853
Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2016 9:23 pm
Location: Tucson, AZ

XY Compensation Calibration

Postby firesped » Sun Jan 01, 2017 6:55 am

Based on calibration guide at reprap.org

http://reprap.org/wiki/Calibration#X_and_Y_Axis

You need this file. You may need to goto the website to download it. http://reprap.org/wiki/File:XYCalibration.stl

This prints a rectangle 100mm wide on the outside and 80mm wide in the inside. Our goal is to find how much calibration we need in order to get this to print out to make it measure 100mm when we measure the actually printed object. I built a spread sheet to find it but it is a little bit complicated because we are dealing with +- gain. so if our compensation is set to 100.07, we are actually increasing it by +.07 and -.07 making it .14 total increase.

Print this out at 100.00 compensation.
use calibers to measure the inside 80mm and outside 100mm for both X and Y.


Notes: This is still experimental if the percentage is correct. looking back at my settings, on my second print, I forgot to change the percentages. However I got different results. I think the issue is due to the effect of the hot bed on the thermal expansion of the plastic. Based on this factor. XY compensation factors might be better served to be in the filament profiles versus being on the printer itself. As different heat profiles are likely influence the the shrink/expansion factor of the filament. I need to run some testing to see the effect on the print at different hot bed temps.

Not sure if the XY compensation would also need to be per hot end as well.

Once I have confirmed the spread sheet is accurate, I will upload it.
RL name: Michael Nolen
printers:
raise3D N2 kickstarter Early Bird
Trinus Deluxe (running smoothieware on Azteeg X5 GT board)
Monoprice Maker Select v2

ABH
Posts: 182
Joined: Sun Aug 14, 2016 7:31 pm

Re: XY Compensation Calibration

Postby ABH » Sun Jan 01, 2017 9:46 am

X-Y compensation doesn't make any sense whatsoever, unless you are thinking of material shrinkage caused by the filaments thermal expansion coefficient. In that case it should be a setting in the "Filament Settings", not in "Printer Settings", as you write.
I don't know what Raise3d has been thinking when they put "100.25 %" in Y-Compensation and 100.00% in X-Compensation, as pinter defaults :-)
The X and Y full-step travel distance for a stepper motor with full step angle of 1.8 deg. and pulleys with 20 teeth's will be exactly 1/10 of the belts teeth distance.
As the belt has a teeth distance of 2 mm, the full step distance is exactly 0.2 mm.
Theoretically you might observe some variation in X and Y travel distance caused by a tolerance on the belts teeth-distance, uneven spacing of the stepper motor poles, or uneven cut pulley teeth. To assume that you can calibrate this uncertainty is however absurd. The variation (if any) will be an uncertainty that depends on what part of the belt/motor-poles/pulley teeth's are being used.

firesped
Posts: 853
Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2016 9:23 pm
Location: Tucson, AZ

Re: XY Compensation Calibration

Postby firesped » Sun Jan 01, 2017 1:08 pm

X and Y compensation is what they designed into ideamaker to correct for the fact that the default axis steps per unit set at 80 for X_Axis and Y_axis may not be right. Instead of doing what they did for the Z_Axis, they just put in 80. When I was configuring marlin 1.1.0 RC8 it gave the formula for setting these correctly. I've found at least 2 things on the current firmware that they set that don't do what is intended.

Just found a more detailed configuration guide then what I originally used that lets the compiler figure out these formulas. I should probably code that in. Where you set the full steps, microsteps, pully pitch and pully teeth. and z rod pitch.

XY STEPS = (full steps * microsteps) / (pully pitch * pulley teeth)
Z STEPS = (full steps * microsteps) / z rod pitch

XYSTEPS = (200 * 16) / (2 * 20) = 80
Z STEPS = ( 200 * 16)/ 4 = 800
RL name: Michael Nolen
printers:
raise3D N2 kickstarter Early Bird
Trinus Deluxe (running smoothieware on Azteeg X5 GT board)
Monoprice Maker Select v2

ABH
Posts: 182
Joined: Sun Aug 14, 2016 7:31 pm

Re: XY Compensation Calibration

Postby ABH » Mon Jan 02, 2017 12:24 pm

I don't really understand what you mean.
XYSTEPS = 80 is of course always the correct number to have in Marlin SW for the Raise3D printers.
The stepper drivers are configured to use 1/16 micro stepping. If you divide the 0.2 mm full step distance I wrote earlier by 16, then you get 12.5 µm, which is our printers horizontal "micro step resolution".
The reciprocal of 12.5 µm is 80 "steps per unit", where the unit is 1 mm.
X and Y compensation in ideaMaker is only relevant for compensating material shrinkage, not for any mechanical compensation, because there's no mechanical uncertainty that can be compensated.

firesped
Posts: 853
Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2016 9:23 pm
Location: Tucson, AZ

Re: XY Compensation Calibration

Postby firesped » Mon Jan 02, 2017 2:09 pm

I agree that X and Y compensation seem to be dealing with material shrinkage. I haven't attempted further prints to test this. Since we are dealing with randomness, printing out X number of parts is more likely the solution to get an average to go by to determine what these should be set to.

This should be a filament setting as not a printer setting. the temperature you set the hot bed to will effect material shrinkage.

I think I may need to generate a smaller model as this will eat up a lot of material in testing.

found something I need to make another thread about.
RL name: Michael Nolen
printers:
raise3D N2 kickstarter Early Bird
Trinus Deluxe (running smoothieware on Azteeg X5 GT board)
Monoprice Maker Select v2

ABH
Posts: 182
Joined: Sun Aug 14, 2016 7:31 pm

Re: XY Compensation Calibration

Postby ABH » Mon Jan 02, 2017 5:48 pm

I would think that shrinkage depends on a lot of parameters, such as
- first of all the material (ABS a lot, PLA almost nothing...)
- bed temperature
- air temperature in your print chamber
- cooling fan setting
- extrusion temperature
- the size of your model (a single small model has a higher average temp. than a large model)

Venphi
Posts: 8
Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2017 1:47 pm

Re: XY Compensation Calibration

Postby Venphi » Mon Aug 13, 2018 10:11 am

Maybe Ideamaker can include what Zortrax have in their software i.e.

Zortrax offsets.png
XY Compensation


This works very well.

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Vicky@Raise3D
Posts: 4427
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2016 3:54 am

Re: XY Compensation Calibration

Postby Vicky@Raise3D » Tue Aug 14, 2018 3:21 am

Thanks for your suggestion. Notes taken.

KS_Husker
Posts: 103
Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2018 2:32 am

Re: XY Compensation Calibration

Postby KS_Husker » Mon Oct 15, 2018 2:29 am

Yes, this is a MUST!! Should not be optional for a company trying to be in the big leagues with others.

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Vicky@Raise3D
Posts: 4427
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2016 3:54 am

Re: XY Compensation Calibration

Postby Vicky@Raise3D » Mon Oct 15, 2018 5:52 pm

Contours and holes compensations have been added into developing list already. You may can see them in next version of ideaMaker.

KS_Husker
Posts: 103
Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2018 2:32 am

Re: XY Compensation Calibration

Postby KS_Husker » Wed Oct 17, 2018 12:48 am

That would be awesome!! I'm glad to hear this. Thank you!!


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