Liquid cooled heat sink for the Pro2

pjyarnall
Posts: 41
Joined: Fri Jun 22, 2018 9:29 pm
Location: Canandaigua, NY

Liquid cooled heat sink for the Pro2

Postby pjyarnall » Tue Aug 21, 2018 3:19 am

There have been posts elsewhere in this forum about the size and efficacy of the Pro2 hot6 end heat sinks. The Pro2 is my first printer so I don't have years of experience with hot ends, but I have experienced a number of "freezes" in the throat tube using higher temp filled filaments that seemed to defy easy explanation. One in particular that is highly problematic is the 3DX-tech Carbon X (Gen 2) nylon. Apparently a lot of Pro2 owners have issues with this filament. After a lot of research I concluded that the issue is probably due to the very small heat sink in the Pro 2 design and the very poor cooling airflow path... particularly for the "default" left extruder.

So I undertook the task of designing a water cooled copper heat sink that will integrate into the present head system.

I have finished the first heatsink and ran it for nine hours just to test for leaks and get a feeling for how effective it is. I printed in PLA, (which has not been a problem), just to exercise the new heat sink. I used an open container with about 16 oz of tap water as a reservoir and a little 12 volt pump for testing purposes. The shop was at 75 degrees. The reservoir reached 86 degrees. I could put my finger on the front of the heatsink and it only registered as slightly warm to the touch. The extruder was running at 205 deg C.

This test is very encouraging. I decided on a E3D pump and cooler kit which will arrive shortly for the working system and the second heat sink is in process. Once it is fully operational I will see how the 3DX Nylon gen 2 filament behaves. The few small parts I managed to print with this filament were very encouraging as far as engineering applications and I really want to be able to use it.

Again... sorry for the rotated image. What gives with this forum software? Bizarre.
Attachments
IMG_3991.JPG
Pro 2

KS_Husker
Posts: 96
Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2018 2:32 am

Re: Liquid cooled heat sink for the Pro2

Postby KS_Husker » Thu Aug 23, 2018 12:00 pm

This is very cool. Sounds like a great idea. I'd like to hear more about this as you do more testing.

BendPro
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Joined: Thu Aug 23, 2018 3:44 pm

Re: Liquid cooled heat sink for the Pro2

Postby BendPro » Thu Aug 23, 2018 3:53 pm

Do you happen to have dimensions or a model file so that I can recreate the part? I am having the same problem.

Thanks, Ken

pjyarnall
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Joined: Fri Jun 22, 2018 9:29 pm
Location: Canandaigua, NY

Re: Liquid cooled heat sink for the Pro2

Postby pjyarnall » Tue Aug 28, 2018 3:08 am

Hi Ken, the part is a Solid works file, which I am happy to share, or the detail drawing that a machinist can work from. PM me and we can work out the details. I finished the second heatsink and the E3D pump and radiator kit is hooked up.
Pro 2

KS_Husker
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Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2018 2:32 am

Re: Liquid cooled heat sink for the Pro2

Postby KS_Husker » Thu Aug 30, 2018 11:30 am

Could you please share some more pictures and details of this system. I would like to see more. And hear how it is working for you.
Thanks

pjyarnall
Posts: 41
Joined: Fri Jun 22, 2018 9:29 pm
Location: Canandaigua, NY

Re: Liquid cooled heat sink for the Pro2

Postby pjyarnall » Fri Aug 31, 2018 3:12 am

I can report that both extruders now have the liquid cooled heatsinks and the E3D pump and radiator are hooked up. The plumbing is still a little disorganized, but the system is fully functional. I needed to get the machine printing. Have been running Max-G PETG w glass at 255C. Heat sinks remain barely warm to the touch. Water in the small pump reservoir stabilizing at about 6 deg F above room temp. I am waiting for the 3DX_Tech carbon x gen 2 which previously gave me fits. That will be the test. I am going to hazard a guess that my freezing problem is a thing of the past. I will post more with photos next week.
Last edited by pjyarnall on Wed Sep 19, 2018 5:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Pro 2

KS_Husker
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Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2018 2:32 am

Re: Liquid cooled heat sink for the Pro2

Postby KS_Husker » Fri Aug 31, 2018 11:36 am

Great work. Can't wait to hear and see more. We had issues with the 3DX_Tech carbon x gen 2 as well. Printed for about 1-2 hours at best before jamming up in the extruder. Usually only got about 45 min. out of it before the jamming occurred.

pjyarnall
Posts: 41
Joined: Fri Jun 22, 2018 9:29 pm
Location: Canandaigua, NY

Re: Liquid cooled heat sink for the Pro2

Postby pjyarnall » Sun Sep 16, 2018 12:22 am

An update on my liquid cooling installation on the Pro 2. The new heat sinks are now installed on both hot ends. I tidied up the pump and radiator assembly from E3D and made up an extension cord receptacle box that includes a switch. The Pro 2 and the little power brick for the pump and radiator fan are plugged into the box. The on off switch on the printer is left on and the switch on the box now turns the printer and water system on and off together. This was to prevent the possibility of turning on the printer and forgetting to turn on the water system. This is also a lot easier than reaching behind the printer to reach a poorly located and difficult to reach power switch.

I have been printing 3DX Carbon X gen 2 all week now. Small parts, bigger parts, slow fine layers and faster thick layers. No problems at all now. I really wanted to use this filament. It is amazingly strong and stiff. The carbon fiber minimizes the warping that is typical of unfilled Nylon.

I should add that I installed modified Olson Ruby nozzles. I can't emphasize what a good investment these are. I primarily print with fiber filled filaments and these are astonishingly abrasive. Brass nozzles are trashed in hours. The Raise3d "hard" nozzles are anything but. They are just the same brass nozzles with electroless nickel plating. A waste of money as far as filled filaments are concerned. The Olson's will last indefinitely. Worth every penny!

I just put up a little, (very ametuer), video on YouTube that shows the system better than pics. Here is the link.... https://youtu.be/p64lOe7awZg

Else where I posted a little on the dry feeder box that I built that integrates directly to the printer. This has greatly eased the hassles of changing - loading filaments and everything stays dry. The box interior is typically showing 18-30% RH.

Everything I have built has been designed in SolidWorks and I have working drawings for everything. My friend and colleague who also has a Pro 2 owns a precision machine shop. He has duplicated my parts for his own machine and may consider providing the harder to make parts if there is interest.

If you are using your printer professionally like we are, the upgrades are easily justified. I wish I had $20 for every hour I wasted disassembling hotends, unclogging nozzles, etc.. At my professional rates, these upgrades have already paid for themselves and my blood pressure stays low. My Pro 2 is finally achieving predictable and consistent results. I can design a part, send it to the printer, and simply wait for it to finish.

Oh yeah... Almost forgot... I trashed the BuildTak surface a month or two back. (Don't ask)! Anyway I did some research and replaced it with a Gecko Tek surface. Not only is it cheaper it is far superior. No gluestick required. Everything sticks. Amazing. Highly recommended!
Pro 2

KS_Husker
Posts: 96
Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2018 2:32 am

Re: Liquid cooled heat sink for the Pro2

Postby KS_Husker » Mon Sep 17, 2018 12:51 pm

Very impressive, I will be looking at something similar for ours. Thanks for sharing.

pjyarnall
Posts: 41
Joined: Fri Jun 22, 2018 9:29 pm
Location: Canandaigua, NY

Re: Liquid cooled heat sink for the Pro2

Postby pjyarnall » Mon Sep 17, 2018 11:25 pm

Thanks, KH-Husker. I am also considering offering a package of all the drawings and a BOM for all the bits. Everything is available from McMaster Carr, Amazon, etc.. I would probably include the drawings for the integrated feeder box as well. It is very much a part of bringing the Pro 2 to a complete printing solution, IMO.
Pro 2

BendPro
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Joined: Thu Aug 23, 2018 3:44 pm

Re: Liquid cooled heat sink for the Pro2

Postby BendPro » Wed Sep 19, 2018 4:56 pm

I am unable to PM you. I got a message that said that I haven't used the forum enough.

pjyarnall
Posts: 41
Joined: Fri Jun 22, 2018 9:29 pm
Location: Canandaigua, NY

Re: Liquid cooled heat sink for the Pro2

Postby pjyarnall » Thu Sep 20, 2018 11:19 pm

Hi Bend Pro,

You can email me if you wish.
Paul.yarnall-at-tech-resolutions.com
Pro 2

Ronvp
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Joined: Tue Jul 17, 2018 9:07 pm

Re: Liquid cooled heat sink for the Pro2

Postby Ronvp » Fri Sep 21, 2018 6:34 pm

Paul, in your video, you have a special spool enclosure on the side of your Pro2.. anyway you can share a link or info on where to get that?

Alex M.
Posts: 179
Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2018 4:59 pm

Re: Liquid cooled heat sink for the Pro2

Postby Alex M. » Fri Sep 21, 2018 6:43 pm

Ronvp wrote:Paul, in your video, you have a special spool enclosure on the side of your Pro2.. anyway you can share a link or info on where to get that?


See here: viewtopic.php?f=18&t=10786&p=35910#p35910

pjyarnall
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Joined: Fri Jun 22, 2018 9:29 pm
Location: Canandaigua, NY

Re: Liquid cooled heat sink for the Pro2

Postby pjyarnall » Sat Sep 22, 2018 5:56 pm

Hi Ronvp... I just posted a video on the Feeder box here... https://youtu.be/-tZGnMbxGqA
Pro 2

Kenny
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Joined: Sun Jul 22, 2018 2:07 pm

Re : Dissipateur de chaleur à refroidissement liquide pour la Pro2

Postby Kenny » Thu Oct 04, 2018 3:27 pm

Hi, news ?

pjyarnall
Posts: 41
Joined: Fri Jun 22, 2018 9:29 pm
Location: Canandaigua, NY

Re: Liquid cooled heat sink for the Pro2

Postby pjyarnall » Fri Oct 05, 2018 2:34 am

News..... My colleague has worked up an estimate on manufacturing the copper liquid cooled heatsinks and has also sent out for quotes from other machine shops to see if we can get a to a lower cost. We have not committed to purchasing any quantity yet due to the relatively modest interest shown so far. Manufacturing cost dramatically improves with large quantities, but at only a few dozen, for example, we would have to price them at approx $125 each to justify our effort and risk. They would have the barbed fittings and be ready to install. Buyers would have to supply their own pump system. We would supply a list of all items necessary with sources.

For a Pro 2 that would mean $250 for the heat sinks(*) and approximately another $150 for an E3D pump kit and other misc items to complete the system conversion. The system has proven to be extremely effective and reliable and worth every $ and hour I spent on an upgrade that makes my printer much more reliable and less hassle.

(*) The existing hot end cooling fan is removed in the conversion, so both hot ends need to be converted to water cooling.

We are offering to supply these to help and support fellow Pro 2 users who are tired of hot end jams. Is $125 per heatsink a price that you would pay? We don't need to chase our tails pursuing making them if no one is interested.
Pro 2

Kenny
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Joined: Sun Jul 22, 2018 2:07 pm

Re : Dissipateur de chaleur à refroidissement liquide pour la Pro2

Postby Kenny » Tue Oct 09, 2018 5:10 pm

Thank you for the reponce! I live in France thus in it adorned me complicated! Would be he possible to have the plans so that I can the made for my printer?!

pjyarnall
Posts: 41
Joined: Fri Jun 22, 2018 9:29 pm
Location: Canandaigua, NY

Re: Liquid cooled heat sink for the Pro2

Postby pjyarnall » Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:36 am

Kenny, I will have to think about this a bit more, but I don't feel it unreasonable to expect some compensation for the time I spent designing, building, and proving the effectiveness of water cooled heatsinks on the Pro 2. The estimated price I noted above does include a modest profit, but given the small quantities involved, it is probably not enough. Shipping to France is not a logistical obstacle.

The photos and videos I have posted should allow anyone with design capability to reverse engineer what I have done and make their own. You are free to to take that path.
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